When Israel re-arrested Palestinian men in the occupied West Bank town of Dura, the detainees faced familiar treatment.
They were blindfolded, handcuffed, insulted and kept in inhumane conditions. More unusual was that each man had a number written on his forehead.
Osama Shaheen, who was released in August after 10 months of administrative detention, told Middle East Eye that soldiers brutally stormed his house, smashing his furniture.
“The soldiers turned us from names into numbers, and every detainee had a number that they used to provoke him during his arrest and call him by number instead of name. To them, we are just numbers.”
My grandfather had a number tattooed on his arm. Never again means never again for everyone.
Shame on Israel. Zionism is an evil racist ideology, distinct from Judaism
They have become that which they hated.
Treating Gaza like an open air extermination camp and even branding them the way prisoners were tattooed in German camps.
Yellow star was already patented
This is no longer a boring dystopia
Literally 1940
ITT: a bunch of non-native English speakers lecturing native English speakers on the meaning and usage of English words in colloquial English :-/
The right-wing religious nutters in Israel read plenty of NKVD and SS manuals.
Writing a number on someone with a marker is not branding. This is stupid. The IDF is committing actual atrocities, and this article is about writing a number on people with a marker and referring to them by that number. Relatively humane prison systems refer to people by their inmate number as well.
What is even going on? This is literally a distraction from the actual terrible things regularly occurring. Think about it this way: within the horrifyingly violent context of Palestine right now, here is an entire article that could be headlined: “IDF Uses New Weapon Against Palestinians: A Marker.” See how absurd that is when there are much more important events occurring?
Who wrote this? The IDF?
They did not hold a prison number sign. Or a piece of clothing with a number. They were marked with the number on their forehead.
No prison system kidnaps people and throws them in a “jail” without process, writes a number on their forehead, tortures them for months and then releases them because they were innocent.
And I do not mean a combination of those things.
I mean not one of those things is done in a prison.
Well the police in Chicago have been accused of running dark site interrogation and torture facilities, it’s cost the city millions in human rights abuse.
Right, but I wouldn’t call those places “prisons,” and even if they once were, they ceased being such when they started using them as fucking black sites to torture people
Its the Homan Square Black Site. Used to be a Sears warehouse. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homan_Square_facility
TBF it depends on the prison. In this comment I will be referring to jails and prisons within the U.S., and I am working with the same assumptions you made in your comment.
People are put in jail without trial all the time, when awaiting trial. This is extremely common especially with poorer people who can’t afford bail.
Most prisons and many jails give prisoners a number, and will sometimes even refer to them only by the number. It’s not written on their head, but it is often attached to their uniform, and they can sometimes be punished for taking them off. It’s weird to write it on their head, and really just kinda silly if you ask me. They probably don’t have the resources for name tags because they’ve spent 200% of the budget on more bombs it seems.
Some jails and prisons have conditions that equate to actual torture according to the UN. Extreme heat without AC, cruel punishments, inadequate nutrition and safety. Most notable of these is solitary confinement, which is a very common prison punishment, and which is rightly classified as torture by the United Nations. Some people spend months or even years or decades in solitary confinement.
I think we all agree that the IDF is committing acts of genocide and inexcusable violence against civilians and captured combatants, but it’s also important to not inflate the facts, and to focus our attention on greater issues. Does it really matter so much that the IDF writes a number on their forehead, when they’re also bombing children? Is a marker really a greater evil than a bomb?
This comment conflates jail and prison as if they’re the same thing, and they are not. It’s an important distinction.
They probably don’t have the resources for name tags…
I know you were making a joke, but it is foolish to believe for one second that this wasn’t done intentionally as a form of dehumanization and public humiliation.
Does it really matter so much that the IDF writes a number on their forehead, when they’re also bombing children? Is a marker really a greater evil than a bomb?
Yes, it really matters. Both things matter. Do we have to make “Israel war crime” tier lists before determining if we should care about something? It’s all awful. And it’s all inter-related anyway. This is the type of dehumanization that allows IDF soldiers to murder so many women and children without remorse.
And I could see someone who does not have an understanding of history, and the historical context around this level of dehumanization, could not fully grasp the symbolism here.
But yes, this is something that we 100% should be talking and worrying about.
Jails and prisons are for the sake of the argument practically the same thing in that both meet all of these criteria. I am not saying that we shouldn’t pay attention to this or catalog it and prosecute the perpetrators, I’m simply saying that the argument of the previous poster was extremely flawed.
People can be held in jail before they are charged but they require a charge and a trial.
Here the IDF is picking up people, throwing them in confinement, beating them up and then throwing them out.
Wiithout a trial ever happening. Nor do they plan it to happen. There is no legal system involved.
Comparisons can be made. Guantanamo bay, Uyghur camps, etc. But that is not what most people call a “jail”. This is kangaroo court stuff.
I agree that the kids getting bombed is bigger news. But seeing “Israel bombed 50 kids today” every single day doesn not hit the same after a while. And it is not really “boring” in the way this is.
I’m not disagreeing that It is a terrible thing. What they’re doing is wrong and they should be punished. However we are not so different, and that is the damn truth of the thing. To that end, my comment was merely pointing out that the previous comments argument was very flawed.
Personally I’d be unwilling to write numbers on people and refer to them by that number, I just read a lot of accounts of the holocaust and that’s too close for me to be around without feeling sick. Don’t know how IDF can stomach this. But, you know, no end to the depth of human depravity and evil. I’m not a great person. Still couldn’t do this.
Revelation 13:16-17 King James Version 16 And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads: 17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.
Behold The Beast
For fuck sake, how blatant does it need to get before people recognize this for what it is?
You mean admit to it? They can just continue refusing.
The people who are willing to recognize it for what it is have already done so.
VOTE
As someone living in “Israel” im not shocked, I wouldn’t be suprised if they put it on their forearms next time
Yea but a number drawn with a sharpie would fade away. Have you thought of some more permanent way of inking those numbers in their skins? Not to mention that the forehead is a bit too much, it might make the guards uncomfortable. Have you considered someplace a bit more discreet, like maybe the wrist? /s
You would think Israel, of all countries, ought to know how blatantly evil this kind of stuff looks.
They don’t care. No one is preventing them from becoming Nazis themselves.
They do, they just don’t care.
They do, and that’s the point.
Israel of all countries is the one desperately trying to prove it’s more like Nazis (strong white Europeans in their opinion) than like their victims. That’s the lesson they got from it all.
They are a broken nation.
And I understand how they become one, what I don’t understand is how Armenians haven’t (having plenty of their own weaknesses, of course).
what I don’t understand is how Armenians haven’t
Because they don’t have a regime supporting them them in that?
Have you not seen anything they’ve done previous to this? It’s all completely conscious, they absolutely mean to treat Palestinians like the Nazis did Jews etc.
This seems vaguely familiar but I can’t quite put my forearm on it.
Elizabeth Warren supporters?
I know a Holocaust survivor who is horrified by everything going on in Israel and Palestine. I also am related to deceased Holocaust survivors and their children, grandchildren, cousins, etc. all seem to think this situation is pretty awesome. They call the Palestinians animals and other terrible things and talk like it’s all political and say that people who disagree with them are brainwashed and unintelligent.
I can’t be 100% certain, but I think I now understand what it was like to sit at a table with burgeoning Nazis and Nazi-supporters and I’m sad to say that I failed the test. Yes, I argued, I disagreed, and I walked away, but I’m starting to get why everyone didn’t just attack the Nazis in Germany. What do you do when you recognize a Nazi but that Nazi helped raise you and didn’t seem to be a Nazi until they suddenly doubled down on the wrong choice?
Personally, I’d tell them they’re the ones behaving like animals, and cut all future contact.
Maybe someday they’ll wake up and realize that they’re on the wrong side of history. Or they’ll pass on to the next life and figure it out when they’re not in heaven.
That sounds really tough man I’m sorry. Thank for you at least sharing your perspective. It’s an important perspective to keep in mind. This stuff gets oversimplified, and often, ironically, by disregarding the element of human relationships.
Institutionalized segregation always leads to conflict. Nations onlynrecover once they abandon that segregation. Israel and Palestine need to come together into one nation as unrealistic as that might seem.
Remember when they almost achieved peace nearly 30 years ago and then an ultra-Orthodox Jew murdered the Israeli prime minister? He was probably a member of Hamas.
\s
“It’s clobberin time”
I know, but when you’re in the actual situation then you start asking yourself “am I really gonna hit my 80-something year-old great-aunt?” And you start realizing that the cops are definitely gonna get called and then there’s gonna be even more Nazis around you and that the new ones have a trigger-happy reputation.
I love my mother dearly and would not hesitate to slap her across the face if she called any human an animal. My grandmother I might not hit but I’d certainly cuss out.
… branding detainees with numbers, check… now, what’s next on Hitler’s to do list?
—Bibi, apparently
It’s not a brand. It’s a mark with a marker. And I think even Bibi and his legions of assholes might be sensitive about tattoos and actual brands.
wow what a distinction.
first of all Bibi is a Hitler apologist. the only thing he’s sensitive about is the existence of brown people.
second of all it’s the same exact shit. the point isn’t the method, it’s the dehumanization.
