No. I think the police protect themselves and their interest. The left need to align the police with their interest. The fact this is missed on you is a big issue
The left need to align the police with their interest.
How do you propose they/we do that when the police have functionally been antithetical to the left’s interests across most, if not all, of recorded history? It’s not like this is an optics issue; state-sanctioned monopoly on physical violence is literally counter to the entire point of being “to the left”.
I don’t know but maybe the reason we have these cycles where we have ok societies until the authoritarians decide we got too close to a leftist society is partially because we don’t fill these roles. That we ignore it or meme ourselves to be against it leaving authority to the right which means we only maintain civil society at their discretion. There is no world where the left fights back against the police and the military and win. It will only ever be what they let you have. It’s gotta change. Even if things go back to some normalcy, as long as we refuse to fill those roles, it’ll just be the same until next time.
And it’s not police. I was military. The military is more left than people realize. When Trump fired them all, it was such a sad state to not see more people fired up. We saw this coming back then. Protests are cute. But they’re nothing without some power behind it. Without police or the military willing to defend your right then your only going to be able to do what they let you.
These people don’t want to hear about reality, they just want to complain while proposing no practical solutions, and call anyone a coward who doesn’t express uncritical willingness to immediately resort to escalation.
The moment they get a figurehead, they’ll tear him or her down, because they’re allergic to any semblance of authority. They keep talking about a revolution, but they’ll never organize effectively because they’re allergic to the ideas of discipline and hierarchy.
I believe in leftist socioeconomic policy, but man is there an over-representation of imbeciles who seem to be dominating the narrative. It’s no wonder the right-wing thinks we’re all MLs. Any leftist who’s not an ML is either afraid to speak up, or gets trashed whenever they do.
It’s fucking hopeless, I fear. And then they get upset when we say our only hope is to vote in a lukewarm Dem. I’d love to see more progressive candidates winning, but the left shoots itself in the foot every time because they’d rather have reasons to complain than actually work on solving any problems.
I don’t know what their long-term plans are. Anarchy? As if that would be any better for women and vulnerable minorities?
Holy fuck, you have no idea what a fresh breath of air you are. I’m going fucking insane. I feel like the quality of leftist in the past 10 years has dropped significantly.
They are all reactionary. They flame constantly. There’s no strategic or tactical thoughts. They’re all just reading that days headlines while arguing or yelling about their feelings.
I honestly think it’s a downstream effect of putin’s hybrid war against the west. FSB trolls aren’t only focussing on radicalizing right-wingers (cause that’s what Qanon was, let’s be honest). They’ve stoked both sides, deliberately promoting discord and escalation, and they’ve effectively created an unmendable rift straight down the middle of the body politic.
So yeah, they seed all this divisive and violent rhetoric, using bot farms to promote it. Then it catches on and like a virus propagates itself throughout the collective conscience. All of the sudden safe online spaces for wholesome debate are rare, and everyone’s at each other’s throats, and even people on the left can’t seem to agree on a course of action because these provocateurs and accelerationists are dominating the narrative.
It fools half the left into following that narrative, and it fools the right-wing into viewing the entire left as unreasonable and violent. It’s kind of mirrored on the other side too. Growing up, I remember not every republican/conservative was a bloodthirsty racist. Surprising, I know. But now so many of them have caught the maga mind virus, and all the sane ones if there are any left are invisible. There certainly are anti-maga republicans, but they’ve lost control of their party.
Reactionary, sensationalist, and dehumanizing rhetoric is just too easy for people to fall into. It must have some deep-seated appeal to the reptilian parts of our brains (the limbic system, that is), because it defies all reason and empathy.
And there are adversaries with decades of institutional knowledge in psyops (disinformation, propaganda, and radicalization) who have been patiently exploiting this vulnerability for years. It’s scary to think how this will impact the long-term evolution of the human psyche…
Ok hold up, let me get this straight. Are you suggesting that the left try and make nice with cops of all people, in a post that you authored showing cops being absolutely reprehensible human beings? Like what are you even here for dude? I honestly do not understand. Why does the left need some protector anyways? Why would you advocate for that specifically, and not for the left to be their own protection?
The left need power and authority. They have nothing without it. They need to put themselves into position of authority or power instead of rejecting it. You’re not fighting a revolution without either.
Have you never considered what a left wing police force could look like? What left wing owned business class looks like. We keep failing into these cycles throughout history because we don’t change these paradigms. It’s like the left gravitate to this idea that to be left you must be poor and powerless. Instead we need to have these groups in society become more left. Much like how the right use groups like heritage foundation or neo nazis secretly put their people in these positions. The left need to wake up and put people in these positions and change the organizations over time.
No I’m not. I’m saying people on the left need to fill these positions. Right now the left vilifiy the job so much that it leaves only Republicans to become police. So again if you don’t become police then you’re only option is to be policed Republicans.
You think leftists can just join the police and fix everything from the inside? Have you tried? You think Republicans are more likely to do the job because not enough leftists apply, and not because the system selects specifically for conservative-minded people?
Leftists don’t villify the job. Leftists villify the system that actively selects against them, educated people, and people with empathy, a system inherently rooted and founded upon racist principles.
The system cannot be fixed from within by infiltrating it with some lefty cops, and your suggestion to do so is laughably naive at best, and maliciously counterproductive at worst. The system needs to be rebuilt and retooled. And that’s not going to happen just by being nice to cops, or by leftists becoming cops.
No. I think the police protect themselves and their interest. The left need to align the police with their interest. The fact this is missed on you is a big issue
How do you propose they/we do that when the police have functionally been antithetical to the left’s interests across most, if not all, of recorded history? It’s not like this is an optics issue; state-sanctioned monopoly on physical violence is literally counter to the entire point of being “to the left”.
I don’t know but maybe the reason we have these cycles where we have ok societies until the authoritarians decide we got too close to a leftist society is partially because we don’t fill these roles. That we ignore it or meme ourselves to be against it leaving authority to the right which means we only maintain civil society at their discretion. There is no world where the left fights back against the police and the military and win. It will only ever be what they let you have. It’s gotta change. Even if things go back to some normalcy, as long as we refuse to fill those roles, it’ll just be the same until next time.
And it’s not police. I was military. The military is more left than people realize. When Trump fired them all, it was such a sad state to not see more people fired up. We saw this coming back then. Protests are cute. But they’re nothing without some power behind it. Without police or the military willing to defend your right then your only going to be able to do what they let you.
These people don’t want to hear about reality, they just want to complain while proposing no practical solutions, and call anyone a coward who doesn’t express uncritical willingness to immediately resort to escalation.
The moment they get a figurehead, they’ll tear him or her down, because they’re allergic to any semblance of authority. They keep talking about a revolution, but they’ll never organize effectively because they’re allergic to the ideas of discipline and hierarchy.
I believe in leftist socioeconomic policy, but man is there an over-representation of imbeciles who seem to be dominating the narrative. It’s no wonder the right-wing thinks we’re all MLs. Any leftist who’s not an ML is either afraid to speak up, or gets trashed whenever they do.
It’s fucking hopeless, I fear. And then they get upset when we say our only hope is to vote in a lukewarm Dem. I’d love to see more progressive candidates winning, but the left shoots itself in the foot every time because they’d rather have reasons to complain than actually work on solving any problems.
I don’t know what their long-term plans are. Anarchy? As if that would be any better for women and vulnerable minorities?
Holy fuck, you have no idea what a fresh breath of air you are. I’m going fucking insane. I feel like the quality of leftist in the past 10 years has dropped significantly.
They are all reactionary. They flame constantly. There’s no strategic or tactical thoughts. They’re all just reading that days headlines while arguing or yelling about their feelings.
But thank you for being sane.
I honestly think it’s a downstream effect of putin’s hybrid war against the west. FSB trolls aren’t only focussing on radicalizing right-wingers (cause that’s what Qanon was, let’s be honest). They’ve stoked both sides, deliberately promoting discord and escalation, and they’ve effectively created an unmendable rift straight down the middle of the body politic.
So yeah, they seed all this divisive and violent rhetoric, using bot farms to promote it. Then it catches on and like a virus propagates itself throughout the collective conscience. All of the sudden safe online spaces for wholesome debate are rare, and everyone’s at each other’s throats, and even people on the left can’t seem to agree on a course of action because these provocateurs and accelerationists are dominating the narrative.
It fools half the left into following that narrative, and it fools the right-wing into viewing the entire left as unreasonable and violent. It’s kind of mirrored on the other side too. Growing up, I remember not every republican/conservative was a bloodthirsty racist. Surprising, I know. But now so many of them have caught the maga mind virus, and all the sane ones if there are any left are invisible. There certainly are anti-maga republicans, but they’ve lost control of their party.
Reactionary, sensationalist, and dehumanizing rhetoric is just too easy for people to fall into. It must have some deep-seated appeal to the reptilian parts of our brains (the limbic system, that is), because it defies all reason and empathy.
And there are adversaries with decades of institutional knowledge in psyops (disinformation, propaganda, and radicalization) who have been patiently exploiting this vulnerability for years. It’s scary to think how this will impact the long-term evolution of the human psyche…
The police exist to protect capital. It is impossible for the left to align with their interests
So you’re telling leftists to “align” themselves with police (the state)?
No I’m saying the left has to figure out how it will get those to align with it
Ok hold up, let me get this straight. Are you suggesting that the left try and make nice with cops of all people, in a post that you authored showing cops being absolutely reprehensible human beings? Like what are you even here for dude? I honestly do not understand. Why does the left need some protector anyways? Why would you advocate for that specifically, and not for the left to be their own protection?
The left need power and authority. They have nothing without it. They need to put themselves into position of authority or power instead of rejecting it. You’re not fighting a revolution without either.
Have you never considered what a left wing police force could look like? What left wing owned business class looks like. We keep failing into these cycles throughout history because we don’t change these paradigms. It’s like the left gravitate to this idea that to be left you must be poor and powerless. Instead we need to have these groups in society become more left. Much like how the right use groups like heritage foundation or neo nazis secretly put their people in these positions. The left need to wake up and put people in these positions and change the organizations over time.
Ok so it sounds like you are advocating for the left to be its own protection.
Remind me again why we need to be nice to police then?
So are you going to ask Republicans to protect you the entire time like now?
What? Dawg that’s what you’re advocating for. Are you ok?
No I’m not. I’m saying people on the left need to fill these positions. Right now the left vilifiy the job so much that it leaves only Republicans to become police. So again if you don’t become police then you’re only option is to be policed Republicans.
You think leftists can just join the police and fix everything from the inside? Have you tried? You think Republicans are more likely to do the job because not enough leftists apply, and not because the system selects specifically for conservative-minded people?
Leftists don’t villify the job. Leftists villify the system that actively selects against them, educated people, and people with empathy, a system inherently rooted and founded upon racist principles.
The system cannot be fixed from within by infiltrating it with some lefty cops, and your suggestion to do so is laughably naive at best, and maliciously counterproductive at worst. The system needs to be rebuilt and retooled. And that’s not going to happen just by being nice to cops, or by leftists becoming cops.
Removed by mod