You started the accusations of narcissim, including inventing that other people were accusing me of attacking them by engaging in DARVO-like behavior then attempting to gaslight me about it. When you weighed in on this conversation it was to mock me for expressing confusion - that was a discussion not an argument, if a rather rude one - in a conversation where I had sincerely asked for someone else’s perspective and was given a perfunctory lack of explanation. Elsewhere in this thread are very minor arguments, sure - all of them based on a misunderstanding, or (after you joined) one person posting a rude meme.
You have refused to engage with what I’ve said from the beginning, and you’ve devolved to even trying to gaslight me about being the one who said they were done with this conversation - which, I note, you continue not to be done with.
Sigh. That’s not how you use that, but I’ll point out you’re trying to gaslight me yet again with it by implying that I was somehow sealioning in that comment or this thread.
Sealioning is a type of trolling or harassment that consists of pursuing people with relentless requests for evidence, often tangential or previously addressed, while maintaining a pretense of civility and sincerity (“I’m just trying to have a debate”), and feigning ignorance of the subject matter.
In this case I’ve only asked you for evidence of one claim once, and then referred back to you not providing it. I’m not after more evidence, and I’m not attempting to badger you into giving me evidence, I’m just trying to get you to stop gaslighting me. Although I’ll happily concede that probably wasn’t you trying to gaslight me just now since sealioning is kinda a weird one (and you’re unfamiliar with it). My bad there.
I’m not even gaslighting you. You were giving OP shit for a post that was clearly meant to be humorous, and you were making blanket statements about tarot which it looks like you’ve walked back in other conversations on this thread.
Where I initially commented, someone had told you that some people use tarot as a psychological tool similar to jungian archetypes and shadow work, and distinguished from religion. You said that you recognize them as distinct concepts, and then doubled down on saying tarot is a religious/spiritual practice.
I pointed out the apparent self-contradiction, although at this point it looks more like it was one step in the process of realizing that tarot has broader use than being limited to just spiritual or religious contexts. But I haven’t seen you say anywhere that you’ve learned something and changed your opinion, and now recognize the secular usage if tarot. It seems like you’ve instead pretended that that was your opinion from the start, as if your initial insistence that it’s religious was just a fluke.
But I haven’t seen you say anywhere that you’ve learned something and changed your opinion, and now recognize the secular usage if tarot.
That’s because I haven’t changed my opinion - I never thought tarot was a singularly religious act in the first place which I made clear at least an hour before you joined in to accuse me of doing exactly that
: https://lemmy.world/comment/22028428 . I’ve never made any claim even presenting it like that besides describing Tarot as religious - which is not wrong, many people do consider Tarot as an aspect of their religion, and being this is an occult community it’s not unfair for me to have chosen to primarily characterize it as such. And setting that aside, the content of my initial message would not have changed had I said:
Maybe… you should say that to your friend, instead of using your shared religious secular beliefs that convince them to stay in a shitty relationship…?
This is why I’ve repeatedly said you’ve misunderstood me - I have never claimed that I was unaware of a secular use of Tarot, nor have I attacked tarot, nor have I asserted that tarot is singularly religious. I do not know how you arrived at that conclusion, even. I asked for someone’s opinion on why they don’t consider it religious, and I sincerely wanted to know what they thought. What I got was:
Jungian archetypes and shadow work reflection prompts.
Which isn’t an explanation about why they don’t consider it a religious act, it’s a set of concepts that are present in a whole host of things. I then said I was confused, because I was, since they didn’t even claim that was why they don’t consider Tarot religious, they just asserted it and then told me I was taking it too seriously. And you’ve done nothing but attack me for that confusion, now even saying that was me “doubling down on tarot as a religious/spiritual practice” which, no, it wasn’t.
You jumped in with your own assumptions about what I was saying and started attacking me. And yes, you have openly been gaslighting me: Again, I never said I was done with this conversation, I never attacked Tarot, I was never accused by anyone else of attacking other people using DARVO techniques (or otherwise?), your sources do not show that happening and I’ve never claimed that Tarot is a solely religious idea. Those are all things you’ve asserted which are false, and which fit into any of the common definitions of gaslighting.
Even going back to the top level comment, what makes you think OP was trying to convince their friend to stay in a shitty relationship? It clearly says “Dump him.”
Earlier I was getting pretty annoyed with you, but now I’m starting to see that you might be on the spectrum. It seems you are/were genuinely confused, so I take back what I said about you being a narcissist and using DARVO. You’re probably not doing it on purpose.
I’m not here to torment you, but you need to get over this victim complex that you have. You’ve clearly blown this whole thing beyond proportion by taking the post too seriously from the start, and when people tried to point out the error of your perception you got really defensive. You don’t seem to understand, and I’m not gonna try to explain it to you anymore. Just take a few deep breaths and try to have a nice day
Your accusations have been stressful enough I threw up. You’ve done nothing but spend hours bullying, insulting and in your words tormenting me over an assumption you made I can prove was wrong. You have not taken back what you said, the comments where you accuse me of said heinous shit, where you gaslight me, where you insult me; they’re all still right there. You’ve haven’t even apologized for doing this to me.
I explained my position to a large number of people, many of whom insulted me on the basis of a misinterpretation, which is a reasonable thing to do when one is being insulted and misinterpreted. You thought someone was doing something wrong, and because of that it justified your being unbelievably horrible to someone else. At any point you could have stopped and considered what I was saying with a shred of decency, but you didn’t.
I was literally a victim - at your hands, and of your reflexive cruelty. You don’t get to walk away from this accusing me of a victim complex and feeling like you didn’t do anything wrong, that’s victim blaming. And now you’ve buried your non-apology 27 comments deep where nobody will see it, so you don’t have to admit that you did an incredibly shitty thing.
(and as a final note, who in the hell thinks that the person posting a meme is the person that created the meme? Lemmy barely has OC, I should know, and it’s fucking awful you’re trying to spin this as you defending OP to justify how horrible you’ve been to me)
You started the accusations of narcissim, including inventing that other people were accusing me of attacking them by engaging in DARVO-like behavior then attempting to gaslight me about it. When you weighed in on this conversation it was to mock me for expressing confusion - that was a discussion not an argument, if a rather rude one - in a conversation where I had sincerely asked for someone else’s perspective and was given a perfunctory lack of explanation. Elsewhere in this thread are very minor arguments, sure - all of them based on a misunderstanding, or (after you joined) one person posting a rude meme.
You have refused to engage with what I’ve said from the beginning, and you’ve devolved to even trying to gaslight me about being the one who said they were done with this conversation - which, I note, you continue not to be done with.
Sigh. That’s not how you use that, but I’ll point out you’re trying to gaslight me yet again with it by implying that I was somehow sealioning in that comment or this thread.
Sealioning means to ignore all evidence while repeatedly demanding evidence in a badgering sort of way, does it not?
Not quite:
In this case I’ve only asked you for evidence of one claim once, and then referred back to you not providing it. I’m not after more evidence, and I’m not attempting to badger you into giving me evidence, I’m just trying to get you to stop gaslighting me. Although I’ll happily concede that probably wasn’t you trying to gaslight me just now since sealioning is kinda a weird one (and you’re unfamiliar with it). My bad there.
I’m not even gaslighting you. You were giving OP shit for a post that was clearly meant to be humorous, and you were making blanket statements about tarot which it looks like you’ve walked back in other conversations on this thread.
Where I initially commented, someone had told you that some people use tarot as a psychological tool similar to jungian archetypes and shadow work, and distinguished from religion. You said that you recognize them as distinct concepts, and then doubled down on saying tarot is a religious/spiritual practice.
I pointed out the apparent self-contradiction, although at this point it looks more like it was one step in the process of realizing that tarot has broader use than being limited to just spiritual or religious contexts. But I haven’t seen you say anywhere that you’ve learned something and changed your opinion, and now recognize the secular usage if tarot. It seems like you’ve instead pretended that that was your opinion from the start, as if your initial insistence that it’s religious was just a fluke.
That’s because I haven’t changed my opinion - I never thought tarot was a singularly religious act in the first place which I made clear at least an hour before you joined in to accuse me of doing exactly that : https://lemmy.world/comment/22028428 . I’ve never made any claim even presenting it like that besides describing Tarot as religious - which is not wrong, many people do consider Tarot as an aspect of their religion, and being this is an occult community it’s not unfair for me to have chosen to primarily characterize it as such. And setting that aside, the content of my initial message would not have changed had I said:
This is why I’ve repeatedly said you’ve misunderstood me - I have never claimed that I was unaware of a secular use of Tarot, nor have I attacked tarot, nor have I asserted that tarot is singularly religious. I do not know how you arrived at that conclusion, even. I asked for someone’s opinion on why they don’t consider it religious, and I sincerely wanted to know what they thought. What I got was:
Which isn’t an explanation about why they don’t consider it a religious act, it’s a set of concepts that are present in a whole host of things. I then said I was confused, because I was, since they didn’t even claim that was why they don’t consider Tarot religious, they just asserted it and then told me I was taking it too seriously. And you’ve done nothing but attack me for that confusion, now even saying that was me “doubling down on tarot as a religious/spiritual practice” which, no, it wasn’t.
You jumped in with your own assumptions about what I was saying and started attacking me. And yes, you have openly been gaslighting me: Again, I never said I was done with this conversation, I never attacked Tarot, I was never accused by anyone else of attacking other people using DARVO techniques (or otherwise?), your sources do not show that happening and I’ve never claimed that Tarot is a solely religious idea. Those are all things you’ve asserted which are false, and which fit into any of the common definitions of gaslighting.
Even going back to the top level comment, what makes you think OP was trying to convince their friend to stay in a shitty relationship? It clearly says “Dump him.”
Earlier I was getting pretty annoyed with you, but now I’m starting to see that you might be on the spectrum. It seems you are/were genuinely confused, so I take back what I said about you being a narcissist and using DARVO. You’re probably not doing it on purpose.
I’m not here to torment you, but you need to get over this victim complex that you have. You’ve clearly blown this whole thing beyond proportion by taking the post too seriously from the start, and when people tried to point out the error of your perception you got really defensive. You don’t seem to understand, and I’m not gonna try to explain it to you anymore. Just take a few deep breaths and try to have a nice day
Yes I’m on the spectrum, and I’m sorry but no:
Your accusations have been stressful enough I threw up. You’ve done nothing but spend hours bullying, insulting and in your words tormenting me over an assumption you made I can prove was wrong. You have not taken back what you said, the comments where you accuse me of said heinous shit, where you gaslight me, where you insult me; they’re all still right there. You’ve haven’t even apologized for doing this to me.
I explained my position to a large number of people, many of whom insulted me on the basis of a misinterpretation, which is a reasonable thing to do when one is being insulted and misinterpreted. You thought someone was doing something wrong, and because of that it justified your being unbelievably horrible to someone else. At any point you could have stopped and considered what I was saying with a shred of decency, but you didn’t.
I was literally a victim - at your hands, and of your reflexive cruelty. You don’t get to walk away from this accusing me of a victim complex and feeling like you didn’t do anything wrong, that’s victim blaming. And now you’ve buried your non-apology 27 comments deep where nobody will see it, so you don’t have to admit that you did an incredibly shitty thing.
(and as a final note, who in the hell thinks that the person posting a meme is the person that created the meme? Lemmy barely has OC, I should know, and it’s fucking awful you’re trying to spin this as you defending OP to justify how horrible you’ve been to me)