Glad he ignored the negativity and succeeded. Personally I don’t see the appeal of this type of game though. But, different strokes and all that.
I honestly couldn’t figure the game out…I’m glad people enjoy it, but I’m too smooth brained to have gotten anywhere
I have a poor sense of direction and just get lost a LOT.
If you get stuck or don’t know where to go next, you can ask the mayor. He will give you a hint for the next location.
If there’s one thing I’ve learned, it’s not to listen to jaded assholes online.
I get the feeling a lot of gamedev communities are full of people who haven’t built anything anyone wants to buy, and so get super bitter towards anyone wanting to try, or anyone who manages to make something that actually picks up steam and becomes successful.
They’re the sorts of people that will go “X Game is objectively bad!” and then shill their own game which is also bad.
The same happens in art and animation communities, where something will become popular and people will disguise their feeling of “Why can’t I get that?!” with “pfft, it’s objectively bad!”.
Most Indie gamedev communities are super supportive of each other, or at least that’s been my experience from TIGSource to Itch.io days.
statistically speaking not every game will be a commercial success.
Speaking as someone who knows a little about game development from formal education in the matter
99% of people on the internet critizing game development have not the faintest idea what they are talking about.
A quick, translation guide (joke):
“I understand that might not be easy but” - would be super easy but there is a list of good reasons why we shouldn’t
“Seems like it would be easy too…” - its a pointlessly impossible endeavour to spend any time on this.
Also with gamedev there is the additional “I have this great idea but I don’t know how to code” community too.
I am sure you are right, but r/gaming is a general gaming board. It’s not really focused on game creation/development.
Some takeaways here:
-
Don’t give up on yourself or your dreams.
-
Keep a steady income going while you work on those things, because then your work can be your art for yourself instead of desperately trying to make something sellable before you run out of cash, and treating yourself to a latté feels like you just blew money on a steak dinner using funds that aren’t coming back. That stuff is scary.
-
Game Dev / Gamer reddit has some gem, but on the whole it is full of very, very bitter people. They got that “everything you do is gonna suck and I’m totally saying this because I care” treatment, and they pass it right along. You’re better off finding /starting a local club.
- Of course, ignore #2 maybe if you’re one of those self-help book authors who is “so tired of their megacorporate 6-figure income after 10 years” and they have zero debt and saved most of that as a runway and can live on 45k a year. Sure, take the plunge and find your soul or whatever lol.
-
reddit specifically has also become a cesspool of hateful, miserable, morons.
And bots.
sometimes at the same time.
The internet really tends to be cruel. I used to open up about myself in some online spaces, but it only made me feel worse. Now I only talk about non personal stuff
I will listen and not judge, especially if you don’t have people in real life you can open up to.
Thank you. I feel like way beyond sociability and repairability these days, though.
I guarantee you, every loser making one of those comments doesn’t do shit with their lives.
They can’t comprehend that in order to get better at things, you have to practice them.
Their lives consist of working, sleeping, and playing video games. It’s pathetic.
i was going to take this online negativity seriously, but i was recently reminded not to
deleted by creator
This is called survivorship bias
I wonder if the opposite principle also has a name.
The first comment imo. is fair. It says that the market is saturated, so it is difficult to succeed, but it doesn’t rule it out by default.
The other two comments are just plain hostile and ended up being wrong. Lets call it dead troll bias or something?
Not really. It should be obvious that not every indie game will be super successful. This is just proof that some random reddit comments saying a game looks boring from an early trailer don’t mean shit, because basically everything will have those.
Right so it’s not really proof of anything.
Well it’s kind of proof that the opinions of haters don’t meant shit. If both good/successful games and bad/unsuccessful games have them and they don’t affect the outcome at all, they have no value.
No it’s not.
The only way to get better at things is to do them. While losers were playing video games to get their instant gratification, this winner was working towards a skill that they could use and build for the rest of their life.
Out of everyone criticizing him, I’d wager less than 10% have any knowledge at all of game development. They will never get that knowledge because they’re losers who are afraid to learn. Learning means admitting you don’t know and coming to terms with all the time you’ve wasted on bullshit.
I miss the days when gaming wasn’t cool.
While losers were playing video games to get their instant gratification, this winner was working towards a skill that they could use and build for the rest of their life.
Okay, let’s not start throwing around unnecessary insults. Calling people “losers” because they play video games is just insulting your own customer base. I don’t know anyone who develops games but doesn’t play them. Let’s not tar everyone with the same brush.
The whiners was called out, not gamers.
Literally the quoted text is calling out gamers, as a group. That is in a fundamentally unhelpful direction to take things in.
You are talking offense to something way off course to interpret what they are saying like that is begging to just lay bare your emotional wound from gaming your young adulthood away brother it’s just not about you. Their message literally applies to this very well, you can make a change whenever. Nobody that games healthy will react like that, they are aware of both the good and bad, of which wasting is definitely a thing…
Might as well give up before even trying! Wtf is this defeatist attitude.
Oh come on. It’s a perfectly valid point. For everyone who has a successful game there are probably thousands of people who don’t. It does no one any good at all to suggest that all you have to do is believe in yourself. You also have to make a good product, and generally just be lucky.
Plenty of people rightfully don’t go into video game development because they cannot afford to not earn their money back, if you are lucky enough to be able to risk it, then absolutely go for it, but if you were living paycheck to paycheck it unfortunately isn’t a reasonable ambition.
Not every game will be successful, on this we fully agree. But for every successful product there will be effort that needs to be expended. There will be struggles and failures along the way and criticisms will abound. The point that I take from the post is that it’s not worth giving into the negativity and let that detract from your efforts. “Don’t take the negativity too seriously” is a perfectly valid message, against which the “survivorship bias” criticism is poorly levied.
The takeaway here isn’t and shouldn’t be quit your job and pursue your dreams in all scenarios.
WTF is this feelgood fascism?
What has fascism got to do with any of this?
No need to get technical. It is a colloquial term to describe the "think positive’ evangelism which implies that failure is due to just not thinking positive enough.
Shitting on hard work and effort of indie devs and then wondering why the gaming ladscape is filled with souless corporate slop.
Yep, same day they’ll complain about Ubisoft and then pre-order the next Assassin’s Creed
deleted by creator
Not really. Anyone who feels “bullied” by voting should get out of the kitchen.
I’m noticing most people on the internet legitimately can’t take criticism because they’ve been living in bubbles their entire lives.
deleted by creator
Careful now, wouldn’t want to rock the boat, how else will I seek validation
I mean, part of the reason why the gaming industry sucks is because indie devs helped prove how low people’s standards are.
I noticed my enjoyment of gaming shot up 1,000-fold once I stopped caring about indie trash again and instead focused on games that appealed to me as a kid, before I was exposed to the low standards of the PC crowd.
he said on a post about hollowknight.
Hey man, you might be new to the internet, but I was around when indie games were taking off.
Fez, slenderman, and even journey all served to show what people were willing to accept. They were all considerably lower quality, cheaper, and easier to make than AAA games.
Hollow Knight is just the latest entry into that category.
Try playing some older AAA games to see how much effort was put into them vs. what you’ve been conditioned to accept now. There’s a world of difference between Castlevania: Symphony of the Night and Hollow Knight.
You just don’t see it because you’ve never played those older games because you’re new to the world and part of the consumer bandwagon.
Hey man, you might have been around a while- a lot of us have- that clearly doesn’t make you an expert.
They were all considerably lower quality, cheaper, and easier to make than AAA games.
You are confusing ‘production value’ with ‘quality’. Being ‘easier to make’ (if that were true) and costing less to produce are both objectively good things, the only way that someone could remotely think they were bad is if they confuse ‘production value’ with ‘quality’.
In 1992 a crime film was released called “White Sands” having a budget of $22 Million. That same year an indie film was released called “Reservoir Dogs” with a budget of $1.2 – 3 million. White Sands had great production values and 11 times more budget than Reservoir Dogs had.
Both films had very good actors, but ironically the Tarantino film was the one that didn’t star Samuel L. Jackson. The ‘production value’ of Dogs is quite low. There are only a handful of locations and the majority of the film is shot in 1 room of 1 warehouse.
Reservoir Dogs is to this day hailed as one of the best films of the genre and a ‘masterpiece’ and White Sands is… I’ve honestly never even heard anyone mention it even once in the last 33 years and had no idea it even existed before googling ‘Crime films from 1992’.
See also “Monty Python and the Holy Grail”, “Halloween”, “Trainspotting”, “The Evil Dead”, “Night of the Living Dead”, “Memento”…etc
Having a huge budget and high production values clearly don’t make a film good or lack thereof a film bad- same goes for video games.
There are plenty of “AAA” games that were turds you’ve just forgotten about them. And there are still plenty of AAA games being released so saying that we’ve " been conditioned to accept (indie games) now." is just wrong. People don’t play indie games because they’ve been ‘conditioned to accept’ them, they play them because they are fun.
Are we putting Fez and Journey in the same bucket as that old ass shitty freeware Slenderman game?
Castlevania would be an Indie game by todays standards in budget, team size and concept.
You are making an argument about 21st century cars based on your favorite 19th century horse carriage.
You don’t understand, clearly.
What makes these games better is that the developers did more with less. They are also simply of higher quality than the indie games trying to copy them without trying nearly as hard.
You should get some experience by actually playing these games and then come back to us.
But that is the definition of today’s indie games. You have games that are done by a single person, or a very small group in a shoe string budget. As far as I know there was no such thing back then, especially in the console market (I can think of a few exceptions on PC) . What today is viewed as less resources back then was still for that time a big studio or team.
Is that a parody? Castlevania: Symphony of the Night famously have a god awful menu screen that was literally a placeholder and they forgot or didn’t have time to change it. Not that it is a bad game, I point it out to say that even back them AAA not always is the Pinnacle or effort and polish, and how can they be, they are subject of so many constraints, like release date to fall into marketing strategies and such, specifically with physical media production. So if a game was to be released for the Christmas shopping season it would not be postponed because a lack of a menu design.
I too was there 3000 years ago and there was a lot of shit AAA games even back them. For one there was a lot of bad habits from the arcade time that made a lot of gameplay suboptimal. I think that it is just survivorship bias because the 90% not great is forgotten with time and we only remember the great games.
But all of that is beside the point, how can you put Fez and Slenderman in the same group? Fez is a great game, there is no lower quality in any aspect of it. In fact in modern games I see more experimentation and innovation in Indie titles and almost none in AAA because they are so expensive they have to always play it safe (same shit happening with the film industry by the way).
Suggesting Symphony of the Night is well-known because of a goofy menu screen is almost comically missing the forest for the trees.
Ok, I reread my comment, sorry, it is my bad, English is not my first language and I should have proof read it. I will edit my original comment.
What I meant was that The menu in Symphony of the Night is famously bad, not that the game is known for or only because of its bad menu.
Now I’m wondering what games are known for their menus lol, maybe Eve Online?
Fez and Journey are in no way shape or form “lower quality.”
Oh year. It’s the corporations who are the good guys.
Do not consider online judgements at all.
Do your thing. Pursue your passions. Do it.I’ve found online feedback useful. You just have to be careful about where you get it and take it with a grain of salt. A very large one.
If someone gives you tips, advice, or constructive feedback: there’s a good chance they’re worth listening to.
Hostile, critical with no other feedback : almost certainly garbage.
The first comment in the image, to my mind, wasn’t actually bad. It didn’t tell them not to do something and it wasn’t critical. It just said they the category was very saturated and they should temper their expectations.
And, you’re also entirely correct that you should take even the feedback worth listening to with a grain of salt, or maybe a shaker. :) There’s a thousand and one ways to do anything, and it can be difficult to convey the difference between “this is how I would do it” and “this is how you should do it”.
(Doing software code reviews is a skill that can help teach the difference, and not everyone learns it)If someone is being mean and negative it’s fine to ignore. If someone is giving constructive feedback that’s negative it’s more worthwhile
I’ve noticed a lot of people who give advice online can’t think for themselves and therefore cannot tolerate anyone doing anything differently from them.
Once I recognized that such an idiot exists and is prevalent on online forums, it became very easy to write them off whenever I see them.
The average internet user is about as smart as the average person these days. We need to dig in order to find intelligence; it’s not the norm.
people who give advice online cannot tolerate anyone doing anything differently from them
Realising this is the key to understand that if you even try to do things differently, you will face people who need to tell you that you are wrong. But you should keep doing what you are doing exactly because you are doing it differently.
But my passion is clubbing baby seals…
Goddamn, that’s an ancient image. 😂
If that is what you love, please club as many seals as it makes you happy.
Don’t let your dreams be dreams.
This is such a weird collection of comments.
I think a few of those people are on here now still moaning about the game being popular.
Except if you’re MAGA. Then I hope you do spiral to the point that you get locked up in the crazy house.
“Democrat voters are more empathetic” lmao
“If you don’t tolerate my intolerance then you’re intolerate too!” Amirite?
my empathy doesn’t stretch to people who voted against my basic rights as a human
Braindead take.
The bar is on the floor if you earnestly want to make that comparison. I don’t see empathetic Republicans anywhere. The closest have been here on Lemmy and even then y’all are sussy.
this would be on r/agedlikemilk
You mean /c/agedlikemilk?
I read it as caged like milk and I leave it there
Hey I heard Cage the Milk is dropping their new album Lactose Obliteration soon!
Why c/ and not l/?
C for community
That makes sense, I like that, thanks for letting me know.
But then why is it r/ and not s/?
Post it! I wonder if those folks ate their words or stand by them or what.
