Far too many people on Lemmy genuinely not understanding the level of propaganda these people are existing in. Breathing it. Eating it. Sleeping in it.
which is even more incredibly fucked when you consider the illusory truth effect, or the effect of something seeming more truthful by the mere repeated exposure to it (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illusory_truth_effect)
Not a valid excuse antmore. We all have access to the internet and can look any of this shit up.
Facts don’t counteract propaganda, at least not on their own. This is well studied.
So proving OP’s point that you genuinely don’t understand how powerful propaganda actually is and the level of it these people are drowning in.
Heavens Gate got a group of people to commit mass suicide. It’s clear you have no idea how powerful propaganda can be and what it can make people do.
Most of them are too distracted by the endless stream of propaganda and brainrot to take the time to look into things. There’s also an excessive amount of denial and it takes character to be open to change your beliefs.
That’s what’s called an opinion. I agree with it. Just doesn’t make it true because you want it to be or because it’s easier.
Stockholm syndrome?
Stockholm syndrome isn’t even really Stockholm syndrome.
What a dumb bitch.
Why the hell would a real survivor vote for the thing that assaulted her?
its like a gay/trans person voting for trump.
Or an immigrant voting for Trump
Or a person married to an immigrant voting for Trump
Or a farmer voting for Trump
Perhaps the operation was so big she didn’t know :(((
She didn’t know he was involved with Epstein maybe but it’s not like it’s been a secret that Trump is a creep and a rapist
Yeah I suppose the assault would’ve addled her brain enough
I just can’t imagine how she Justified supporting him to herself at any point. His involvement with Epstein is not new information. We’ve known for years and years.
He’s admitted on television to sneaking into locker rooms at beauty pageants, and talked about his own daughter like his trophy girlfriend. How those don’t trigger anything for her is astounding.
Not just that but the “grab them by the pussy” dude will bring justice to rape victims? That’s a serious moment to repose and question your judgement skills.
Old men who lust after teen girls are not looking for intelligent conversation.
Just votes from women, particularly white women, seems to work.
https://truthout.org/articles/yes-55-percent-of-white-women-voted-for-trump-no-im-not-surprised/
I’m starting to believe the average conservative is just that stupid. They can’t connect the dots on their own and they can’t tell the truth from lies. If you tell them A -> B and B -> C they won’t come to A -> C. You have to explicitly show them A -> C for them to see that. And that works only if there’s nobody else (like Trump) telling them A can’t lead to C.
I can imagine her justifying supporting Trump because Trump said he had nothing to do with the kids stuff. We’ve known for years but for her all it takes is Trump saying he didn’t do it and in her eyes we’re wrong.
“Conservative”. Self identifying conservatives need lean into the question “conserve what?” harder.
Methinks many succumb to mistaking politicians mean the same as their best hopes of conserving community standards against degeneracy, rather than conserving the corrupt establishment.
Its like racism, you see someone who looks unlike you do something, you want to justify them not being like you or not human so you cant relate what they did to yourself
“Conserving the corrupt establishment” is the only thing “conservative” has ever meant. Any claims to the contrary have only ever been lies intended to delude their marks and useful idiots.
Implausible.
It means many different things. [Thus cannot be “only”]
Even if after the alleged original fact, that’s not “ever”.
They don’t get to dictate the one true way, and rewrite history.
And I suggest you should not be repeating their propaganda so.
They don’t get to dictate the one true way, and rewrite history.
Exactly, which is why you shouldn’t believe them when they pretend conservatism is anything but defending hierarchy.
This still seems to fall foul of the orwellian contortion and conflation and inversion of language, subtly doing the very thing overtly advising shouldn’t be done. Can’t get there from here. [Edit: from where they’re capitulated to and held at the head of the hierarchy of who gets to define words.]
It’s not quite as simple as stupidity. I think it’s poor critical thinking, plus a strong resistance to questioning their own beliefs. Combined, those things do appear to be stupidity, but there’s a difference.
Combined they appear to be stupidity because they are stupidity.
What else would stupidity be?
I don’t exactly know, but I’ve met conservatives who are highly skilled in their own complex fields of expertise. They can’t possibly be stupid and still be good at their jobs.
I think dismissing people as “stupid” just helps build barriers. We need to understand why conservatives do what they do. Why do they consistently vote against their own interests? Why are compassion and empathy seen as weaknesses?
Bob Altmeier makes the argument that it’s not that they can’t think, it’s that they were taught not to. It helps reduce conflict when the people above you get things wrong.
theres nothing to understand, they either are acting stupid, or stupid or thier not. cant have it both ways lol. its not that hard.
We need to understand why conservatives do what they do.
They are stupid. They don’t have to be stupid about everything to be stupid about their voting choices. They vote conservative/Republican/whatever against their own interests for a wide variety of reasons from it being the one their parents voted for all the way to dumb shit like ‘owning the libs’ because it makes them feel like they are on a team with people as stupid as they are. If they weren’t stupid they would notice the fat fucking orange turd who can’t string words into a coherent sentence is the face of the party tearing down every positive thing the country does.
They are stupid in lots of different ways. Can’t fix stupid. We need to motivate the unengaged voters by having the party farther to the left actually stand up and accomplish things in a way they get credit for.
That’s the definition of stupidity
All of the dots were connected for them. All the way from hunters laptop to trans woke Marxist grooming of kids rampant throughout our pretty independently run education systems, Biden’s letting millions of criminals into the country to rape and murder our families and inflation that came from… Uhh well they just said it was Democrats fault.
When every mother father sister brother friend coworker and aquantience is getting fed lies 24 hours a day intentionally made to make you hate specific groups of people, “They’re raping the dogs!” It gets to the point you don’t have to believe everything is true, you just know you can’t ever vote for Democrat.
People start to believe things and eat up the lies on accident. A good example is Nancy Pelosi. She has some shit policies and views, but anyone who has ever stated she was involved in insider trading has been a MAGA supporter. Every one. There have never been any evidence that she was involved in insider trading, and people have looked for near 2 decades now, but guess what, people who don’t like the way our capitalistic system works, are prone to want to hate or dislike rich people, so they want to believe it’s true, and they do. And they spread that misinformation far and wide helping support MAGA. Most didn’t do it intentionally, but that’s the end result, building support to mistrust and hate anyone left of MAGA. So when the option was MAGA or anyone left of MAGA, a good chunk of people said… well I guess MAGA isn’t that bad.
Because all his other deviancy didn’t affect her until this one.
Because she believes she’s the exception. All conservatives believe they are the exception.
just like gays, trans, black and latin trump supporters
Genuinely: how do you do those mental gymnastics. That’s fucking wild.
The problem is that they believe what they want to believe, not what he actually says or does. It’s like a game of telephone where nobody actually fact checks each other. One person sees a speech by Trump that says he’s going to solve affordability by defunding stuff that he doesn’t care for or doesn’t benefit from. He tells his friends and coworkers that Trump is going to solve affordability but barely mentions how. Those friends are also conservative so they don’t ask for more details they just say “hell yeah, about time” and then move onto the next topic without elaborating. Next those people tell their friends the same thing and if they get asked how they just say “I don’t know, it’s just what x was saying.”
Fast forward a few months and it’s election day now everyone associated with that person, some of who don’t spend a lot of time on the internet so they aren’t really up to date on current events, have this vague idea that Trump will solve their problems. They’re too busy with their own lives and never get a good opportunity to do look things up or actually research what candidates are doing what, but they heard Trump had some good ideas and they’ve voted for Republicans before, so why not?
This is the reason why republicans and Trump love the poorly educated and love making life expensive. It makes people so caught up in their own bullshit and so uninformed that they make poor decisions because they either don’t have the time or don’t understand what’s going on.
that was my bro when asking about trump, he dint care to search further/research other than what he heard on social media. when confronted about trump, elon, or YE WEST he believes whats on the news is not what he saw on social media, or whatever someone else told him. thats how they think. and hes in tech too, but im seeing alot of upper middle class tech people as conservatives, especially amongst asians/pocs.
They’re too busy with their own lives and never get a good opportunity to do look things up or actually research what candidates are doing what, but they heard Trump had some good ideas and they’ve voted for Republicans before, so why not?
I know during election time the political machines go hardcore about getting people out to vote, but i’ve always argued that a person really shouldn’t vote if they can’t take the time to research and dig into the candidates they are voting for… I used to also get dismissed for saying as much but then televisions Mike Rowe (formerly of Dirty Jobs) echoed the same sentiments and I saw the political crowds do a a 180. -Oh, well. I’m not bitter.
sad how mike rowe turned into nutty trumper being used by fox pundits like watters. the first istance of that guy cracking was after trumps 1st election" he said in an interview how its not that bad"
Mike Rowe is directly funded by the Koch brothers, he’s genuinely a paid right-wing propagandist spreading anti-union propaganda, and the idea that hard work and ignoring or removing OSHA safety regulations is a path to the American Dream.
I have never been able to quantify it like this. Thank you
conservatives are experts at reality distortion.
Shitty people can also be victimized.
i think you got it reversed, victims can also be shitty people.
I agree with you, but after reading it 6 times to make sure we’re both not stupid… it kinda makes sense in both directions
Not even. It’s just sad
Not when she drags us all down with her
Given the propaganda going around at the time (both times, even), I imagine a lot of people are in the same boat. A lot of people got real drunk on desperately guzzling the hopium, and are now “enjoying” the hangover.
Maybe I should have leaned into the sarcastic tone harder every time I said things like “maybe they care”. I didn’t realise their rose tinted hopium steamed glasses would have them interpret that literally!
~ Just in case it’s not too late (especially with all that “third term” noise going around), I’ll re-tell this little story:
In 2004, an ex-colleague of Trump’s was back in our home town, in our fave pub, telling us stories about what a joke Donald Trump is, what a played narcissist, being primed by his psychopathic handlers for a puppet presidency. … It seemed a bit too far out there implausible in 2004, and remained seeming implausible for about a decade… :/
Moral of the story:
He’s their boy.
(So, stop falling for it.)
they were in the honeymoon phase, i think some people who drank the koolaid still are. farmers being wrecked by trumps tariffs mysteriously vanished from the news cycle, republicans quietly trying to “fund them” without seing as the sole cause of thier misery.
I agree, except
the sole cause of thier misery
gives punch too much credit.
Puppets for placation and provocation.
Problem space is further upstream in the thick and dark.
Solution space is nearer than many are yet to realise.
[No strongman to save us. We are the ones we have been waiting for. We can still mend this. Salvate Invicem.]
Also, impeachment’s nothing.
Fucking stupid cunt.
Any complaints about Trump don’t matter if you didn’t vote for him.
I think we can see why this particular person is an ‘Epstein survivor’, while many of the others were ‘Epstein fatal victims’. Act completely clueless and they’ll let you live, since you don’t pose any risk.
The only way would be religion. Her Christian dogma just couldn’t be overcome.
