Do you know where I can get this sticker or attribute the artist that made this?
Bi colored guy here. I don’t advertise my sexuality but also don’t hide it.
There’s always a few folks that are shocked when I very happily tell them about my KS7.
I used to be a gun salesman at a huge destination store. I remember us selling hundreds of guns a day when Clinton was running for President. I’m also a leftist, which was very unusual for a gun salesman.
One time, we had a trans woman come in, and some of the other salesmen started snickering, but I went right up to her. We started talking about what she was looking for, and it turned out she was pretty knowledgeable, as she’d served in the Marines pre-transition. She was looking for a target pistol, and I found a used CZ-75 Shadow in the back and she was super happy with it. We were talking during the background check and checkout process, and she opened up that people had treated her like an outcast at the range and at her church, and I told her about a place I would shoot that was less-Republican, and I even talked to her about the university church I used to work for that had trans people on staff and hosted the annual transgender day of remembrance and told her that there were kind people out there.
Some of the other sales guys spent the whole time snickering, but I didn’t care. My managers were thrilled because I was selling to someone that everyone else was ignoring.
The next week she came in with a few trans friends. They were looking for me because they were interested in getting into shooting but didn’t want to feel judged. There were a few “Chilie’s got some more girlfriends” jokes, but I sold a few more guns.l to people who would end up getting more into the hobby.
Over time, more and more queer people would come in, but I wasn’t always there, or I’d be with another customer, so the other salespeople would end up having to help them, and it started to click that they were just people. Eventually, I got promoted away from the department, and I eventually left the store for a real career, but I got to watch the store become a kind of destination shop for queer folk looking for guns. And more remarkably, I saw some pretty hard-core right wing people open their minds a bit.
I’m not going to claim miracles, but the department probably went from 90% anti-trans to like 40%, which isn’t amazing, but is a huge improvement. I’m still a little proud that I was able to help start that trend, and I still have left-leaning friends ask me gun advice, or ask me to teach them and their kids about firearm safety even if they hate guns.
You’d be surprised at the number of folks who’ve never actually talked to a trans person and only know them through the alt rights propaganda of them.
I met my first trans friend through tabletop RPG and it was pretty clear after a pretty short time that they were a genuinely good person and I was an ass. I very quickly came to value them. It wasn’t as cut and dry as all that as I most definitely had to rethink my (shitty) view of the world. But they are one of my two best friends, and of the two the most trustworthy and reliable.
I guess all I’m saying is, once they’re welcome in a space, it’s easy to see that they’re just people. Pretty sure we all know that here, but the same cannot be said for those outside our circle of lemmings. I’m happy to see a greater example of my experience in your story.
Based and pro LGBTQ Pilled
that’s not the way I expected that to go
thank you for sharing. genuinely
I fucking love you. Keep up the good work. Check in on your neighbors, organize if you can.
Expense aside I couldn’t trust having one so easily accessible to me with what these monsters have done to my mental health.
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Keep in mind that 9mm and .223/5.56 are rock bottom as cheap as they’re ever going to be.
The window to do anything at a reasonable price is closing everywhere fast.
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Find a friend or few that you can split the cost of buying a gun with, then share while you practice. You may not be able to have one you can have on hand, but being comfortable with a gun is one of the biggest hurdles early on, and we’re going to be seeing a lot more of them soon…
Most of us who have guns… don’t have just one, find someone near you with a range on the blazing sword website and go train with them.
:(
Don’t ever let money be the issue of why you can’t defend your rights.
Rent, credit card debt, bills… All of that doesn’t matter when people start disappearing.
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I am very happy to reach out on your behalf to any of the groups I posted. There are often folks that will help with training on the range. DM me if you like.
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The firearm would be at the range run by the group, either SRA or JBGC or Blazing Sword
SRA is a good organization. However they are apparently fractured and their politics may not align. https://socialistra.org/
https://www.blazingsword.org/ is better for LGBTQ+ anarchists that tend to not get along with Tankies.
A more decentralized option could be a John Brown Gun Club https://www.counterextremism.com/supremacy/john-brown-gun-club
DM me and if you show up to one of the ranges, I’ll donate ammo to them on your behalf that you can use. Usually there are courses where you can show up unarmed and they will give you training and gauge your interests and motives. Also I implore you to let yourself take up space and to accept help however it may come. You don’t need to go to a gun range to find solidarity but there are many people out there that would really love any time or presence you can give. Showing up to a rally or a protest is free. Be well and remember that you are deserving of attention. All aid is mutual, all you need to do is show up.
I can’t seem to figure out locations for any of them besides SRA who only have one on the other side of the state from me (and I can’t be doing a 4 hour drive to learn about guns on a regular basis). I live in Missouri which is flooded with MAGA which, even as a cishet dude, I don’t feel comfortable around.
https://theliberalgunclub.com/about-us/logo/ I cannot vouch for the above but they say they have instructors in Missouri, you could reach out, if you can afford a class I’m sure that the instructor would tell you where friendly ranges are.
If you have the means to go to a “regular” shooting range this article could help. I do apologize for the AI art, however the talking points are valid. If taken with a grain of salt. https://liberalwithagun.com/what-to-expect-at-the-gun-range-as-a-first-time-shooter-liberal-friendly-guide/ Also you don’t need to buy all the shit on there. In fact I would suggest just going to a Cabella’s or similar and buy 100 rounds of 9mm if you want to try a handgun or 5.56 if you want to try an AR. Rent the gun at the shop, and the shooting lane. Let people know you’re a new shooter. You’ll get whatever test you need to pass according to your state (if any, I know, it’s insane) and also the RSO will likely show you the way to safely handle the weapon.
A hipoint pistol can be had for about a hundred dollars. I’ve definitely been in a place in my life where a hundred dollars might as well have been a million. So I get it, I do. But if you can swing it, a cheap pistol throws lead just as fast as an expensive one does.
Training doesn’t have to cost a lot. Just use it. Get comfortable with it. You don’t have to do fancy drills or fire from the hip. Just use it.
I’m fortunate to have free state game lands to go to. Perhaps you do too.
Bullets cost a lot when you’re training from 0
True, they’re not free. But when you shoot with purpose and you’re not just mag dumping, it’s worth it.
Do you have any good guides on this? One of the things I have seen with new shooters is adjusting to the sound of the gun itself is its own barrier.
I apologize if I’m offering you specifically unsolicited advice, this is really just a general answer to your question. If you’re interested, feel free to DM me and I’m very happy to talk to you in a more specific sense if you’re an RSO for a leftist range or if you’re interested in becoming one.
This is a great resource for talking to other leftists about self defense and to help them navigate what they feel they can do, or what they feel they need.
https://theanarchistlibrary.org/library/j-clark-three-way-fight
As far as training, there are tons of great drills for beginners, the first course I usually teach doesn’t include any live ammo, just some pop cap training ammo. First we go over gun safety basics, all guns are loaded, what the muzzle is, never to point that muzzle at anything you do not intend to destroy, where the index finger goes, what a good grip is, what a good stance is, how to use the iron sights, how to use the optic, then after that. I go over the manual of arms of whatever weapon they’re training on, usually one of mine in 9mm or 5.56. That’s usually the first day. Then I ask them what they want to train on the next time they come and to please bring a box of whatever ammo they’re looking to train with. That’s really just to gauge interest as I almost always send them home with that ammo and help them work out a plan to get a firearm.
I usually send them this article to check out before they come to the range. https://liberalwithagun.com/what-to-expect-at-the-gun-range-as-a-first-time-shooter-liberal-friendly-guide/Once they have a weapon I usually show them some good dry fire drills to do at home, with an empty magwell of course. https://proarmory.com/blog/dry-fire-drills/ is a good resource, don’t buy any of the shit they’re suggesting though. Not for the first year atleast.
As far as drills go once they understand what a weapon is and I’m confident they’re not gonna perforate me?
These guys are chuds, but it’s a good course of fire https://www.pewpewtactical.com/low-round-count-drills/Not unsolicited, very much so appreciated.
Not really, to be honest. Practice, experience, and learn from your mistakes. ;) I just shoot when I can and pick up random knowledge here and there. It helps if you have a friend with more guns than you because they’ll be willing to show them off.
As for the sound, I almost always go outdoors. Fresh air is better for your lungs and ears than an indoor range.
Get a suppressor. They can be expensive, but if they’re legal in your state, look into it. They’ll save your ears and make the concussion go away. Your shooting neighbors will appreciate it too. Feel free to PM with any questions you might have.
It does when you have no income and debt and not enough credit left to buy a shitty high point.
And having the mental stability with which to not inflict harm upon yourself with said firearm, of which I’m not confident I have, so me too :D
No no get it and training and aiming with it firing coupel shots save all the other shots. But train mainly with airsoft to fire cheaply while learning to maneuver/positioning/etc
Fixed: (No no thats good. Get firearm and training and aiming with it firing couple shots save all the other shots for when needed. But train mainly with airsoft to fire cheaply while learning to maneuver/positioning/etc)
Anyone got a internet checklist of what people should learn? Theres a lot that has to be learned then hourly daily practice to keep it refined
Edit: My brain went through it with first part of post commenting without sense what I meant to say. To put it frank that’s good for them!!
Sadly I’m on the verge of homelessness so I’ll just have to be easy pickings in the new nazi states of America.
Best of luck out there. Look for community. Don’t be afraid to ask for help when you need it.
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https://translifeline.org/resource_category/relocation-assistance/
Reach out to any of the groups on here, they’ll help if they can. Also they fucking live for this shit, so not calling is more of a burden than calling. They would be legitimately happy that you reached out.
I bet you are not too far from a DSA or PSL chapter, you will find LGBTQ community there and they are very understanding of having no money. Also they will likely be able to help with other monetary burdens.
At this point, if your state reps are still driven to make more gun laws, they’re not helping. They are ensuring that maga is grandfathered in to gun ownership while the people looking to become gun owners this year are pushed back.
All modern gun control came from a fear of the Black Panthers. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mulford_Act
Reagan started fucking us over well before he became president.
Yup, most gun laws restrict ownership and usage by POC more often than a white person.
If you’re currently versed in Firearms and are able to start a chapter, or if you are lucky enough to live in an area with a local chapter the SRA is a good organization. However they are apparently fractured and their politics may not align. https://socialistra.org/
Thanks to @[email protected] https://www.blazingsword.org/ is better for LGBTQ+ anarchists that tend to not get along with Tankies.
A more decentralized option could be a John Brown Gun Club https://www.counterextremism.com/supremacy/john-brown-gun-club thanks to @[email protected] for reminding me.
Good basis of organized tactics. The guide below is more about organized movement than direct fire. Below will NOT help you in a firefight as it relies on a much larger trained force than you are likely to have. Good to know what the bastards study though. https://www.trngcmd.marines.mil/Portals/207/Docs/TBS/B2F2837 Rifle Squad Tactics.pdf?ver=2015-05-27-100939-710
How to avoid getting balled up and kettled.
https://theanarchistlibrary.org/library/anarch-ish-how-to-win-at-kettling-a-guide-for-non-policemenSabotage guide from WW2
https://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/26184.txt.utf-8General armed defense
https://theanarchistlibrary.org/library/organizing-armed-defense-in-americaHow to organize a rapid response from a very high level with further detailed resources.
https://southerncoalition.org/resources/rapid-response-101/Good general advice on organizing, also a good resource to find groups near you that are likely aligned. https://www.fiftyfifty.one/organizer-resources
Feel free to reach out for any other resources.
On a more practical “where can I buy a gun” level, https://www.gunbroker.com/ is basically ebay for guns, serves the whole USA, and has been very reliable for me over the years. The catch is the guns are not mailed directly to buyers, a local gun store acts as middleman to receive and you go pick up from there. Saves a lot of time and money if you know what you’re looking for.
For knowing the law in your state about you can and can’t own and carry, start here:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_laws_in_the_United_States_by_state
Just as general advice for those new to online gun purchases. Please visit or call the shop you’re shipping the gun to give them a heads up. Often they usually have a nominal fee for taking delivery of and storing the weapon until you can pick it up. Also they’ll securely store the weapon until you pass any needed background check.
https://www.blazingsword.org/ is better for LGBTQ+
SRA unfortunately has a ton of tankies…
I’ll also recommend the John brown gun club
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Shiiiiiiiit I did not know, I’ll update my post. Thank you for the info.
You’re good, a lot of people don’t know it is. This is why I volunteer my range for blazing sword vs the SRA.
Nah, I’m well. You’re good. You’re helping make marginilized people safer.Thank you.
Do tell how the SRA is “tankie”.
You’re joking right? The subreddit is heavily tankie and the forums before they took them offline where also tankie. I’m sure there are some people who aren’t like that, that are members of the SRA, but the majority is super tankie. Just look at their mission statement, it’s even got anti-capitalist as part of their mission.
No, why would I be joking? What’s the joke? Seriously, can we dive into this? What about my comment made you think I was trying to be funny?
subreddit
forum
You’re basing your opinion of a leftist org entirely on your personal internet experiences. Basing your opinion of an organization on internet experience vibes is not wise.
Just look at their mission statement, it’s even got anti-capitalist as part of their mission.
If you think being anti capitalist is synonymous with being a tankie, then you’ve done a better job discrediting yourself than I ever could have.
The SRA takes great pains to communicate the idea that they are a broad coalition of queen folks, people of color, anarchists, marxists, maoists, marxist-leninists, etc… united in the belief of anti capitalism. Their whole shtick is that any and all leftists can join united under the idea of learning about guns - regardless of individual philosophy. The fact that youre lobbing around the word “tankie” at zero hour of the fascist descent, in combination with equating “tankie” with anticapitalism, in combination with spewing FUD about one of the most successful and inclusive leftists gun rights orgs, makes it pretty clear that youre just one of the typical radlibs who aren’t ready to commit to reckoning with the United States’ burgeoning fascism.
Thanks for proving my point… nothing like an .ml tankie to come swooping in and drop some hot ass garbage.
PS. You can go through my comments, I’m a hardcore 2a guy who’s volunteered time with the pink pistols via my firearms and my own range, before blazing sword and they combined. The fact that you’re acting like those of us who don’t like fascist in any form are ok with swapping right wing fascist with you tankies version of authoritarianism is just hilarious.
Radlib lol first time I’ve heard that one.
This queer socialist has been armed up for 30 years.
I understand it as an individual decision, but on a social level…damn, this isn’t the path to a healthy society.
We’re past the point of any chance of being in a healthy society, unfortunately. Best we can hope for is a healthy society rising from the ashes of this one.
What also isn’t part of a healthy society is feeling like if you’re next, wondering if your neighbors are okay, questioning why there are armed masked men outside of your kid’s school.
That’s why I say that as an individual decision I understand it, but arming society massively and indiscriminately doesn’t solve that, it only leads us to a dark place
I hate to tell you but we are currently in a dark place. I would love to have common sense gun control, after the threat of a dictatorial regime is past. I don’t want what happened in Singapore to happen here.
I am trying to not engage with the gun nuts but I just want to point out:
What also isn’t part of a healthy society is feeling like if you’re next, wondering if your neighbors are okay, questioning why there are armed masked men outside of your kid’s school.
Actually, I would argue all of those are a part of a healthy society. Because all of that is you being part of a community. You don’t decide “Nobody else is safe but I am going to be”. You actually question if the people living near you or your co-workers are struggling. And you wonder how you can make things better.
No. Living under a christofacist regime is not healthy. But nobody is going to be able to protect themselves when the shit hits the fan. We have constant evidence of that.
But people CAN protect their friends and neighbors. Individually we are weak. As a collective we are strong. And if folk would put even a fraction of the effort they put in to kitting out their PSAs into actually checking in with that neighbor to see how they are doing…
You can do both. However you express your rights, I support you. Community builds Solidarity which is our greatest weapon. Ammosexuals are fucking annoying little boot licking chuds. But not every person that is armed means you any ill will.
https://theanarchistlibrary.org/library/j-clark-three-way-fight
All the power to them but it’s a bit late to “prepare” for it.
Second best time is now
Also, the article is a year old. So I guess the second best time to prepare was then. Now is third.
Xeno’s best time to prepare: the nth best time to prepare is halfway between the (n-1) best time to prepare and now
But then we will never be prepared, we’ll only know the best time in which we could have started.
If you use the gun to pass a gun buyback program, it’s more like a rental. If you use it effectively enough, we could pass a gun buyback with very high payouts, and you could turn a profit.
At some point it just becomes “try to only point your security blanket at yourself, I guess” levels of helplessness.
But to anyone considering buying a gun:
Owing a firearm makes you (as of 2020) 8-35x more likely to kill yourself with it https://med.stanford.edu/news/all-news/2020/06/handgun-ownership-associated-with-much-higher-suicide-risk.html. And considering this is a purchase during a… let’s just say “immensely stressful” period… yeah.
But also… what purpose does it serve? A single ice nazi comes knocking on your door, you spot them through the peephole, and have time to grab your gun, load it, and fire through the door? Then… you flee Everything in the hopes that the cops don’t decide to label you a “cop killer” on top of that?
This is why gun nuts make their entire lives built around “systems” to always carry a gun and be able to quick draw. Because the reality is… whoever shoots somewhat accurately first probably “wins”. Which leads to “Well… maybe that phone in their pocket they weren’t even reaching for is a gun. I am legally justified”
But that also basically works for only the first few people to try it. Everyone else gets a squad of ice nazis either kicking down the door and flashbanging them (and themselves) or just unloading on the house from the curb.
I realize the world is scary. I am scared shitless more often than not. But think through what buying a gun can even accomplish versus all the risks.
Because “If I can’t protect myself, who will” is a very valid question… but… the sad reality is that none of us (alone) can protect ourselves. This is WHY republicans and the like are so pro-gun. They know that a “well armed militia” hasn’t been able to do shit for decades.
And maybe consider reaching out to your local community organizers to figure out what CAN be accomplished.
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I don’t imagine one person protecting themselves from ICE with a gun, but I’d kinda like to see some local armed militias prevent ICE from terrorizing people.
Like I said: Even an organized and well trained militia are pretty much useless against a modern military. Police departments around the country have armored vehicles for these situations and any militia that gets too “uppity” is begging for a drone strike… or even just a mortar.
But yes. Individuals can’t do anything. We only have strength when we work together and look out for each other. An individual buying a gun to “protect themselves” isn’t gonna do shit and is mostly just going to escalate things rapidly. Whereas a community protecting themselves, with firearms or otherwise, can at least buy time.
But that requires coordination and a LOT of focus on “optics”. Again, The Black Panthers are historically one of the best examples of this. Yes, they have guns and do armed patrols. But mostly it is about community service and outreach so that killing one Black Panther means you are accepting the murder of that entire community. That isn’t going to stop things once things accelerate to a full blown civil war (just look at Vietnam, Iraq, and Afghanistan for what the US military will gladly do to a village…) but it DOES buy time.
But Americans have this mindset that just buying a gun turns you into John McClane and you are going to single handedly solve all the worlds problems in three respawns or less.
Even an organized and well trained militia are pretty much useless against a modern military.
Just going to ignore all the times modern militaries have lost to insurgent groups?
Civilian deaths (North and South Vietnam) 405,000–627,000
The Korean War (1950–1953) resulted in a massive civilian death toll, with estimates ranging from 1.5 million to over 3 million, often cited as exceeding 50% of total casualties
…
Not including combatant casualties.
In skirmishes? Sure.
In terms of wars? Not so much.
The quintessential example is the US (and USSR before us) in Afghanistan. Yes, the Taliban and the Brave Mujaheddin Fighters ™. And… hit and run tactics… sort of worked. Moreso against the USSR where those militias were being armed by a different military superpower… and where the USSR troops were already behind the curve gear wise. Against the US? It is less that the Taliban et al “won” and more that we lost. We were bled out during an unpopular war where we had no meaningful objectives and no desire to actually fight and kind of just… left.
You aren’t going to bleed out the US Military to the point that they and the christofacists leave the continental US (or even Hawaii… Alaska we would sell to putin in a heartbeat). Instead, you are going to see something a lot closer to the nazi occupation of Western Europe where you just have mass punitive executions until people turn on the guerillas.
We aren’t at the point of pitched battles. People are calling for resistance.
And of we do end up at all out war with the government, the military will likely shatter and be considerably less effective than the military that couldn’t defeat the Taliban.
And do you think this would be a popular war? Fairly certain it would be less popular than any war the US ever fought including the US civil war. That at least had a purpose a reasonable number of people supported.
Which is a very different topic than “Just going to ignore all the times modern militaries have lost to insurgent groups”
But sure, let’s address your new argument while ignoring the old one:
People are calling for resistance.
Yes. And we need to understand what resistance is going to make a difference. One person owning a gun to protect themselves… isn’t even going to accomplish the stated goal. A well trained militia… ignoring the fact that getting one of those takes a lot more time than we have, is also going to be of very questionable value once the civil war goes hot.
But going to protests and speaking to the community organizers and figuring out how to protect each other? THAT is proving incredibly effective… at least for this phase.
And of we do end up at all out war with the government, the military will likely shatter
Having spent years having to work with military folk and officers… I doubt it. That is an entire org built around “just following orders” and “being apolitical because I serve the office, not the man”. Yes, people will bitch and moan. But they’ll get told “It doesn’t matter if you agree or disagree with the war. What matters is that you look out for the man in the trench next to you”. And once the bullets start coming back, they will gladly hose down however many protesters or militia soldiers they can because “it is them or us”.
be considerably less effective than the military that couldn’t defeat the Taliban.
Again, the Taliban did not defeat the military. The US government did. In fact, in most skirmishes (that weren’t just ambushes and IEDs), we massacred them.
Because, “victory” in that case is convincing the christofacists to leave “their country”. Which is the exact same reason the taliban just stuck around, waited for the coalition to leave, and went back to oppressing people.
But this also has the added factor that we already see with fuckface: It won’t take too many massacres by the military before the soldiers that we thank for their service realize they will be massacred if they lose.
The only way a civil war goes beyond “We put down isolated groups of terrorists” is if the military (whatever branches) tends to align with different forks of the government. I… am not optimistic with that and suspect any isolated bases deciding to not support the christofacists will realize how quickly they run out of supplies. But it could happen.
The militias will, at best, be cannon fodder to stand in trenches. Which… is what we see in Ukraine. Trained soldiers can engage in maneuver combat and take ground. Conscripts/militia can get given a gun, pointed in a general direction, and try to prevent those maneuvers from working. But a well equipped combat force is still going to steamroll over them.
We’ve seen already instances where ICE has backed down when there was some actual resistance
And we have seen instances where the ice nazis murder first and fabricate an excuse later.
If they think someone in an apartment has a gun, they aren’t going to run away. They are going to just shoot. What makes ice back off is when the community stands up and makes it clear that they are going to have to murder a LOT of people to get what they want… and that works for now.
Which is why fuckface is working so hard to get the us military to “support” ice. They are actually trained for this and will just chuck some grenades into that apartment.
Just to add on. This is nothing new. This is why cops/swat do so many “no knock raids”. The idea is “Well, this person might be armed so we are just going to sneak up, kick down the door, flashbang every crib we can find, and shoot anyone who resists”.
And that works because even if you “train a lot” and carry your glock in your waistband 24/7, shock and awe tactics disable brains at all “training levels”.
You’re entire argument is they’re killing us already, we really don’t need to give them another reason…
You prepare now, when you can still buy arms, not after when you have had that right and other rights taken away.
That is my position. It would be cool if peaceful protest succeeds at reforming the nation, but I don’t think it would happen. In such a situation, having the resources and accepting the possibility of violence would go a long way towards saving the lives of innocents.
If it turns out peace works, I would gladly end my gun range subscription and abandon social media. I want to spend my time with anime girls, not the bullshit that Trump and his kind are flinging around.
But you’re suggesting that we… don’t arm ourselves, and that we should just stand by and let them kill us…make up your mind
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A Lemmy user trying to encourage people not to buy guns to protect themselves? Simping with maga?
Ok so what’s your advice? If you’re just here to convince ppl not to arm themselves you’ve gotta have a better option?
Complying their way into a camp seems to be this coward’s plan.
And maybe consider reaching out to your local community organizers to figure out what CAN be accomplished.
That is my advice and it always is that.
Individuals cannot do anything no matter how high your killstreak was in Call of Duty last week.
Communities… can’t do as much as we would like but it is about strength in numbers and protecting your fellow human being. And community organizers ARE the people working on this.
But people get pissy when you tell them that they aren’t going to solve everything by buying a PSA rifle and maybe going to the shooting range a few times a year.
As for what that kind of resistance is? A lot of it is just actually talking to other human beings to help them work through the terror we are all living with. Some of it is keying in on the weirdo who set up a stingray detector and getting them a bullhorn. And some of it is literally getting off your ass to provide an unarmed front that says “if you want to get to these people, you gotta go through us” to ice. Which is what we have seen work incredibly well throughout the country.
As for things beyond that? Maybe don’t talk about that on public facing social media?
911 is a joke and there’s a non-zero chance they’ll kill you if you get the wrong officer and you don’t satisfy their favored supremacist purity criteria. I’d rather be armed and not outsource my safety to someone I cannot trust. I also trust myself to resolve situations in my home with better judgement than a person who more than likely joined the police to live out their violent power fantasies.
I’m having a hard time taking you seriously when you’re discouraging organizing. 2A oriented groups are legitimate forms of organization and have a role to play. This isn’t about becoming an army that will fight the military, it’s about providing security when the state can no longer be trusted to do so and serving as a disincentive to right-wing paramilitary groups.
You’ve got this mixed messaging saying “the real resistance is talking” but alluding to “things beyond that” presumably organized direct action or civil disobedience. Why can’t a 2A group do both of those things?
“Individuals cannot do anything”
The way you’ve framed this encourages apathy and the role we all have to play in any organized movement. Rather, we’re all individuals and we all have a duty to do something. When ‘individuals’ work together with common interest that is the very definition of ‘community’.
How long have you been hanging out with the military folk and officers you mentioned in this thread? I wonder if your harsh judgement of the means others which to assemble and express their rights is being influenced by overexposure to pig-headed thought.
people need to arm themselves to protect each other in the moment, not as some grand attempt at a revolution. nobody thinks Americans would win against the military through battles alone, but 200 armed citizens against 50 ICE nazis would be better odds at saving someone during a protest or demonstration or kidnapping.
we have to be willing to suffer consequences if we truly want to protect each other.
If there’s a protest with 200 people openly armed and standing in ranks, I imagine it would keep the 50 ICE clerks far enough back that they couldn’t kick old ladies or shove photographers. I also imagine they would quickly call it an illegal demonstration and bust out the tear gas.
If there’s a protest with 200 people scattered through the crowd with concealed handguns, it’s not going to change ICE tactics at all.
we have a history of armed protests in this country and they have never escalated into confrontation. the black panthers marched armed and were left alone. i know that doesn’t mean it’ll be that way always but it is a tactic that has worked well. the problem is yes, fascists use resistance as evidence of violence and the need to control their opposition, but resistance is still the answer. nothing will do will be innocent enough to be ignored. we will never win by ceding any ground.
it shouldn’t be a random carrying event, it should be coordinated. it should be something organized within the protest.
Don’t shoot through the door.
- It won’t kill the person on the other side
- You can’t guarantee who / what is on the other side.
4 rules of gun safety
- Treat All Guns as if They Are Loaded: Never assume a firearm is unloaded, even if you think it is. When handling, immediately check the chamber, receiver, and magazine to confirm it is empty.
- Keep the Muzzle Pointed in a Safe Direction: Never point a firearm at anything you are not willing to destroy. Control the direction of the muzzle, ensuring it is safe, even if you stumble or fall.
- Keep Your Finger Off the Trigger Until Ready to Shoot: Keep your finger straight along the frame or outside the trigger guard until your sights are on the target and you have made the decision to fire.
- Be Certain of Your Target and What’s Beyond It: Positively identify your target and ensure there is an adequate backstop. Bullets can pass through targets or ricochet, so know what lies beyond.
Buy a gun (or even a replica) and train with it. Just being familiar handling a firearm will drastically increase your effectiveness should you find yourself in a situation using a gun. Maybe you’re issued a gun as part of some militia and have minimal time to prepare by that point.
https://youtu.be/lYJk_ioERK8?t=513
Just having a gun and not training with it will only introduce an element of lethality into your life that previously wasn’t there. At least if you train with it than you’re deriving value even if you never have to use it for real.
Not to diminish your comment, but this research is tautologically flawed:
Men who owned handguns were eight times more likely than men who didn’t to die of self-inflicted gunshot wounds. Women who owned handguns were more than 35 times more likely than women who didn’t to kill themselves with a gun
I mean… obviously? I bet sailors get bit by sharks more than Great Plains farmers. This is the wrong denominator — they should be looking at all cause mortality and all types of suicide in gun owners vs others.
I definitely do believe owning a gun would have a higher suicide rate by making it more convenient to use the gun in a moment of weakness/impulse.
That article brutalizes the original research for a scarier popping headline.
From the actual paper, the important bit:
Rates of suicide by any method were higher among handgun owners, with an adjusted hazard ratio of 3.34 for all male owners as compared with male nonowners (95% confidence interval [CI], 3.13 to 3.56) and 7.16 for female owners as compared with female nonowners (95% CI, 6.22 to 8.24).
Handgun owners did not have higher rates of suicide by other methods or higher all-cause mortality. The risk of suicide by firearm among handgun owners peaked immediately after the first acquisition, but 52% of all suicides by firearm among handgun owners occurred more than 1 year after acquisition.
This is the interesting bit for me. If you remove people buying a gun for purpose of suicide, all cause mortality is the same, which indicates that purchase of a gun for suicide is a relatively small proportion of all gun owners.
Also important to note: this type of statistic does not differentiate no difference from not enough data to say there’s a difference, which is important. P value/frequentist statistics cannot say no effect, ever.
Next you are going to tell us that buying a firearm with threaded barrel is a scary feature and should be banned like WA state has already done.
Then kindly stay out of the way of those that do carry.
A firearm is not a good solution to anything. It’s a tool of last resort. If i believe I, or some one I love is going to die. At that point, i don’t care if i can beat the military, or if im labeled a cop killer because the alternative is Im dead. This isn’t about being a hero, this isn’t about saving my neighborhood or my country, this isn’t about beating the military. Owning and carrying a firearm is about giving yourself one last option when all else fails. When you know you will die without it, may as well have the chance to do something.
Firearms also work as a deterrent. They are a show of force. Without it, the government has a monopoly on violence. Cops, ICE, the military, whoever. When they are they only ones with the ability to do that, we will always be under their thumb.
I’m not saying we should be resorting to violence unless there is absolutely no other choice. The very last thing i want is a shootout or fight with any government agency. I will not win that fight. But I would rather die standing and fighting then die on my knees.
I strongly believe that it is everyone’s responsibility to do their best to protect themselves and those they love. Go exercise. Go learn martial arts. go learn how to shoot. Not because you plan to use violence, but so when violence is used on you, you are not helpless.
I’m not going to point out the flaws in your statistics. Someone else already did that.
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