Are all ya dumb fucks who refused to vote for Kamala happy?
Ya happy all your trans friends are about to be sent to concentration camps so you could virtue signal your pathetic hollow support for Palestine (that’s actively doing far worse under Trump than under Biden BTW)?
Hope all the death and destruction partially on your hands was worth you feeling like a special little hero for a few hours last November.
I voted for harris. This will not matter to any centrist, since I spoke out against their only policy.
The anti-genocide left was too insignificant to listen to, according to the pro-genocide center. Now they’re solely to blame for her loss, according to the pro-genocide center.
It can’t be both. Either they’re too insignificant to listen to, in which case they’re too insignificant to blame, or they’re to blame, in which case they’re kingmakers and you should have listened to them.
Both sides are not the same. Kamala would clearly have been less authoritarian and evil. Unfortunately the Democrats are currently so shit that voting them in, even repeatedly, won’t fix this mess. That’s because the current authoritarian form of the GOP would continue to sit at the sidelines, gathering support via populism for another term or terms, until it gets voted in, because the Democrats appease them at every turn and allow themselves to be dragged to the right on any and every issue the GOP chooses. This doesn’t work and the GOP end up winning. There were four years in between Trump 1 and Trump 2 and they did nothing to tell a story which counters the fascist othering of LGBT, brown and immigrant people (which will expand to “the left” , then anyone who disagrees with anything they say, and then finally members of their own club, as fascism always does). The GOP have changed the game, and the Dems are still playing by the old rules. Until someone like Bernie or AOC gets control, the actual quickest way out of the current tragedy is to let fascism eat itself, a process that may cost literally millions of lives. But sadly, voting in a Democrat gov is no longer a way to avoid this.
Ok, fine - everyone who didn’t vote is irresponsible and unreliable and a bad ally or whatever, and also let’s do Fox News’ work for them and blame left-leaning emancipatory movements for our problems.
Now what? What viable allies, what options, does this frame of reference leave you with? What are you going to do now?
I’ve spent a lifetime watching people blame the ones closest to them for their problems, while the real enemy is right in front of them. It’s a powerful human impulse, and it’s the primary right-wing impulse. I’m not foolish enough to think it’s ever going away. I can only hope, like I hope of right-wingers, that you’re not too far gone into rage and despair to understand what’s going on.
I can only hope that at some point, before it’s too late, you’ll consider how far a political establishment needs to fall that the people it’s supposed to stand for find it less depressing to tune out; that the only people who engage with the system do it to bring in a guy who’ll tear it all down. I hope you’ll be able to direct your rage at the people who truly deserve it.
I hope you find a way to work with the rest of us. Otherwise, I hope that you’re strong enough to fix this yourself.
Sure, let’s hold the victims of fascism accountable for the actions of fascists.
If you’d actually read my comment, you would have realized that you’re demonstrating exactly what I was talking about. You want to hold fascists accountable, but you don’t have the immediate means to do that. So you turn around and victim-blame your fellow sufferers.
You’re not the first person to fall into this trap. It’s the entire reason people voted for Trump - if you can’t change the system that’s screwing you over, at least you can punish the people around you and call that accountability. I hope we can be smart enough not to do this to each other, but the responses in this thread are making it hard to be optimistic.
So, ironically, I’m going to tune out of this conversation too, before it crushes me even more. I’m going to try to find hope and courage elsewhere, because I’m all out of it at the moment. To the rest of you, whoever you are, I hope you can find it too.
I would love to know how many people actually refused to vote for Kamala for the reasons you stated. Obviously it’s not zero, but I have seen some variation of the “are you happy now?” comment hundreds of times, and I’ve never spoken to such a protest voter in real life. Or maybe they’re everywhere and they’re too embarrassed to admit it.
Instead of pointing to gerrymandering, voter suppression and potential massive election fraud, the mass of comments like yours is starting to feel like straw manning.
My dude, look at the replies to my comments. These people are outing themselves.
Guilty conscious maybe?
Of course they would be more hush hush about their fuck up now. Who but the most imbecilic narcissists would say gleefully as minorities are being shipped end masse to concentration camps that they intentionally refused to act to stop it?
I will always understand having grievances for the democratic party because all they do is defend the status quo - I do too - but not voting over that is just fucking stupid. You want to change that? Go to protests, vote in primaries, support local initiatives for ranked choice voting, donate to causes you find actually beneficial, support local politicians that dont just support the status quo, support movements you believe in. If its about Gaza, speak up about that, donate to humanitarian funds, etc. There are ao many things you can do that can impact these things. But refusing to vote does actually fucking nothing for that cause.
There is no world in which more people refusing to vote for Kamala would have gotten us a better president or stopped genocide in gaza. Or really had any impact in any way that wasn’t making trump more likely to win. IMO the folks that did that were doing it more for themselves so they could feel morally superior because they didnt vote for the candidate that supported genocide or the “status quo” even though it literally never would have had any impact on either of those things.
(And let’s be real - trump is way worse for Gaza than Kamala would have been. I’m sure she wouldn’t have done enough, just like Biden, but at least there are voices in that party calling out Israel. Those voices fall far more deaf on this administration’s ears)
Yep, I could not agree more. Seeing the smug and the self-righteous still proudly argle-bargling about Gaza is infuriating, if you ask me. I don’t know how many genuinely feel this way when it’s online - many could just be paid Russian stooges or bots, for all I know.
But I do know a few IRL and when it comes up, it’s hard to keep my cool. It’d be one thing if they didn’t act so goddamned morally superior about it all. I’ve noticed that all of the ones I know of IRL are not in at-risk groups, other than a few cases being women and some being not active xtians (but raised xtian), if that counts. But all of them are white, all of them are at least middle class, none are gay/trans…probably most have the means to get the fuck out of this country if they really had to, etc.
I mean… It kinda was. Netanyahu deliberately stalled peace talks because he wanted Trump in power and he knew that killing Palestinians only hurt Kamala politically, it never hurt Trump because his voters don’t give a shit.
this is not a war, it’s been America helping the colonial occupation empty its largest concentration camp
they could have just stopped sending unlimited bombs to that genocidal occupation, but they chose to anyways in spite of all evidence that it was going to cost them the election.
they could have just stopped sending unlimited bombs to that genocidal occupation, but they chose to anyways in spite of all evidence that it was going to cost them the election.
They preferred losing the election to telling netanyahu no.
Every year the DNC says “we got less votes this year! Must be the centrists voting for republicans, we gotta be more moderate!” and then somehow those folks turn around and say “the democrats are too moderate, if enough of us don’t vote, the DNC will see they are losing support and realize they need to come back left!”
As leftists, we need to act in the best interests of the working class. If that means electing an arrogant cunt over a demented fascist, that means electing an arrogant cunt over a demented fascist.
The left refusing to vote for Hillary in 2016 didn’t move the party left. We didn’t get Bernie, we got Biden.
Why? Because a fascist presidency didn’t make people think “hey, we need a real progressive for real change”, it made people scared and panic vote for who they perceived was the “safest” vote, which was Biden.
History will repeat itself (assuming we even have a fair enough election in 2028, let alone 2026).
americans are stupid, a side-effect of decades of neglecting their primary and secondary education systems, they will only learn through direct personal pain…and now that pain is coming.
the best move to support/protect those effected, and to make sure they know whose helping them and whose out to get them
you’re not a leftist if you’re actively choosing to advocate and vote for the Liberal presidential candidate. -That makes you a liberal, again, not a leftist.
Leftists actually cared enough about the working class and all marginalized persons that they actually bothered to research what the best viable option was for those groups, and accurately determined it was Kamala.
Fake leftist virtue signalling pansies who’s support for such groups is entirely hollow and self serving on an almost narcissistic level instead boycotted voting for Kamala and quire literally bent over and gaped wide to allow fascists to win the election.
The only fake leftists here are you.
It is your legacy that you spoke for no one when it mattered most. Not ours.
Literally all of those people are russian/chinese agitators and you got agitated.
Lesson: make an effort to not get agitated. Learn to meditate or something. You can still have convictions and even get angry, but get angry when needed, not when somebody deliberately makes you angry.
Perhaps this is a conspiracy theory, but it looks to me like Lemmy was built by Russian and/or Chinese trolls specifically to agitate people against the West. They haven’t been attracted to be here, they have been here from the start.
I’m trans and I didn’t vote for Kamala. Blue state, not like it even mattered. I have zero regrets about it on my part either. Since then all the liberals seem to be busy meeting the moment with capitulation and self-censorship, it’s clear they were never allies. I don’t care if I end up in a concentration camp, fuck this rancid ass country.
I’m trans and wish you wouldn’t project your not caring onto the rest of us. It only serves to show that you probably haven’t experienced anything even remotely close to concentration camps or the related dangers. I did not happily do it with a smile on my face, but I voted for Kamala because I knew that this exact thing would happen if Trump were elected. It was incredibly obvious. Gaza is even more fucked, even more bombed, gestapo is roaming the streets, and we’re actively discussing our community potentially getting sent to concentration camps.
But you decided to not even try to prevent it. You decided that because Kamala wouldn’t completely stop the genocide in Gaza, that Gaza, immigrants, trans people, and minorities should all suffer even more.
I’m not sure how you still feel good about your protest vote (being in a blue state doesn’t excuse it, either. You do not vote in a vacuum, especially when you talk about it online). If we ever get to vote again, I really hope you make better choices and don’t get caught up on a single issue. You should be able to choose the lesser of two evils, because if Kamala were elected, we would be in a better position to make actual, valuable change for things like Gaza, trans rights, and progressive reform. Obviously, we can’t know how much better of a position, but I can guarantee we would at least not be discussing how we’re going to be sent to the camps.
I get that our community is hurting. Please don’t make it worse for us because you’re apathetic.
hi, I ended up here in the US as a result of a right wing coup in my home country. I have had relatives with first hand experience of war, civil war, famine. it’s not something I take lightly which is why I am so appalled at the Democrats treating Palestinians like they’re expendible.
We don’t have a popular vote, due to how the system is arranged my vote hasn’t once mattered in decades of electoral participation. You’re kidding yourself about the influence of the fediverse if you think my comments had any impact.
I’m apathetic about voting, I’m actually extremely active organizing in my community against this shit. I find the people scolding about votes while doing fuck-all otherwise to be the ones making it worse.
It’s okay to be appalled, it’s normal. I’m appalled too. But because of our shitty, two party system, you are basically made to choose between the lesser of two evils in swing states. Choosing to not vote, or to vote for another party risks this exact outcome. While your vote in your state may not have had a direct impact (I’m willing to relent on that for now), what you say online (Lemmy or otherwise) or in person can convince someone in a swing state to also be apathetic, and that’s what hurts. It only has to affect one other person in a swing state, and then they’ll also spread their apathy to other voters in the state. It’s not a huge logical leap to consider.
When I say that you’re apathetic, I’m only talking about your voting habits. I know nothing else about you or what you do. I’m also not sure how trying to show how this behavior could result in our current situation is “making it worse”. I’m not trying to be insulting here, but if this apathy continues for the midterms (if they actually happen), it could very well convince some people to also not give a shit. I don’t want others in states where it really does matter to see your comments and think it’s all good to become entirely apathetic.
What really got to me was your comment about not caring about getting sent to the camps. Your relatives experiencing pain and trauma is one thing, but to experience concentration camps yourself is another thing entirely. You saying you don’t care about that could also be seen as you saying that you don’t care about the rest of the community being sent there, as well.
I’m not sure I buy the apathy contagion theory, I have a hard time believing anyone is actually swayed by me.
frankly the comment about not caring about getting sent to the camps was mostly being edgy to the guy doing the vote scolding like it even makes a difference now. maybe the Democrats would have been less bad overall, but after their past actions I have no reason to expect that Palestinians would be any better off under them.
my vote is a no-confidence vote in this shitty system and if supporting trans people becomes no longer politically expedient I fully expect that Democrats would cut us loose too.
People can be swayed by you without you ever knowing it, or even without them really even realizing it.
We can’t ever know if dems would’ve been much better because we lost that chance, but the GOP literally campaigns on being pro-genocide, so we knew where they stood on the issue beforehand. And we got even more confirmation of that now.
Similarly, we knew that the GOP would do everything they could to villify and condemn trans people. At least the dems didn’t fully campaign on it. Since you’re in a blue state, I wonder if you have protections that trans people in red states do not? I sure do, in my blue state. The dems here didn’t just talk about improving trans rights and protecting us, they actually did it, and have continued to do so. They did the same thing for abortion rights. Of course, not without massive complaints from the local GOP.
We can’t ever know if dems would’ve been much better because we lost that chance,
The democrats ran on a year+ of genocide, I have no confidence that they would suddenly have a change of heart afterwards.
The democrats in my state do in fact pass some protections, but do basically nothing about the fundamental economic and housing inequalities that make it almost impossible for red state trans people to safely relocate there. If you’re someone who can hustle enough to afford to live here it’s relatively safe, but despite all that we still have plenty of right wing democrats triangulating over things like womens sports.
I’m trans and I very much care about not ending up in a concentration camp, please. (And yes I voted for Harris, but for the love of God can we take over the primaries next time, so the neoliberals are the ones holding their nose and voting?)
Since then all the liberals seem to be busy meeting the moment with capitulation and self-censorship, it’s clear they were never allies.
It was never about being allies with the liberals. It was ALWAYS about choosing the best VIABLE choice for the working class, for minorities, for women, for our planet.
And y’all dropped the fucking ball.
Even in a garunteed blue state, action I spires action. Discourse even to just a handful, has an echoing effect to someone who can male a difference. But you lot lack any strategic vision or foresight.
I don’t care if I end up in a concentration camp, fuck this rancid ass country.
Spoken like someone who hasn’t experienced real danger and doesn’t even comprehend the real danger their in.
If it means anything, I don’t give a fuck what happens to you specifically either. I give a fuck about the millions of innocent people who are now damned to death and suffering. And all of it could’ve been avoided if more leftists were actual fucking adults and observed the reality before them last November.
Even in a garunteed blue state, action I spires action. Discourse even to just a handful, has an echoing effect to someone who can male a difference.
It was the democrats participating in a genocide for over a year in advance of the election that had the ‘echoing effect’ of making people not want to vote for their disgusting asses. Just being realistic, a trans anarchist in a blue state not voting for bomber harris has literally zero impact on how anyone else voted.
But you lot lack any strategic vision or foresight.
You’re the one acting like scolding people over votes while the gestapo is roaming the streets is accomplishing anything
It was never about being allies with the liberals.
It was the democrats participating in a genocide for over a year in advance of the election that had the ‘echoing effect’ of making people not want to vote for their disgusting asses.
The Dems were also the only party that hosted any politicians in power who opposed the genocide.
Does the GOP have any that oppose the genocide (outside of the JQ like with MTG)? No.
Was Biden and Kamala gearing to mass deport and arrest anti-genocide activists and demonstrators? No.
Did Biden and Kamala give Netanyahu the greenlight to fully annex Palestine, and expand the war to include all of their neighbors, Iran and Yemen? No.
You have to be TRULY delusional to think the genocide is about the same now as it was under Biden.
You people couldn’t, for even a moment imagine it getting worse, even as the entire GOP was painting the picture for you in front of your face. Now its worse, exactly as everyone with a functional brain could for see.
Your lack of strategic vision and foresight, and let’s be real your completely hollow virtue signalling for faux support, is your problem that you’ve made other peoples’ problems.
Just being realistic, a trans anarchist in a blue state not voting for bomber harris has literally zero impact on how anyone else voted.
Just being a realist, action inspires action. Complete apathy towards the issue “because I live in a blue state” objectively had an echoing effect onto swing states with other potential blue voters. You aren’t escaping culpability with your cope.
You’re the one acting like scolding people over votes while the gestapo is roaming the streets is accomplishing anything
You’re the ones who refused to act when it mattered most and was most easy to do so.
I’m scolding you because you people enabled this shit to happen to begin with to feed your egos.
No one who opposes fascism should ever turn to you, or anyone else who participated in the virtue signal boycott, for alliance against fascism. You are untrustworthy and unreliable.
But hey, cope to protect your ego harder 🤡🤡🤡🤡
Again, I’m sure the feeling you got from virtue signalling is worth the end of any semblance of safety for you and everyone you love.
They’re not credible opposition.
Not you totally missing the point
Y’all ain’t credible allies, antifascists, or even anarchists for that matter
Actually I think it’s vitally important that voters learn from this. Or you’ll all be doomed to repeat this mistake again in the future, if you get the chance that is.
Are all ya dumb fucks who refused to vote for Kamala happy?
Ya happy all your trans friends are about to be sent to concentration camps so you could virtue signal your pathetic hollow support for Palestine (that’s actively doing far worse under Trump than under Biden BTW)?
Hope all the death and destruction partially on your hands was worth you feeling like a special little hero for a few hours last November.
You guys still cant accept that your candidate just sucked? No? Still blaming leftists and minorities?
I voted for harris. This will not matter to any centrist, since I spoke out against their only policy.
The anti-genocide left was too insignificant to listen to, according to the pro-genocide center. Now they’re solely to blame for her loss, according to the pro-genocide center.
It can’t be both. Either they’re too insignificant to listen to, in which case they’re too insignificant to blame, or they’re to blame, in which case they’re kingmakers and you should have listened to them.
I sleep like a baby knowing I cast no vote for a genocidal administration nor a fascist one.
No, really, I sleep so well.
Something something both sides same.
One side, forgive student debt and invest in infrastructure.
Other side, masked agents kidnap off street, send people to concentration camps, and censor free speech.
See, both sides same.
Both sides are not the same. Kamala would clearly have been less authoritarian and evil. Unfortunately the Democrats are currently so shit that voting them in, even repeatedly, won’t fix this mess. That’s because the current authoritarian form of the GOP would continue to sit at the sidelines, gathering support via populism for another term or terms, until it gets voted in, because the Democrats appease them at every turn and allow themselves to be dragged to the right on any and every issue the GOP chooses. This doesn’t work and the GOP end up winning. There were four years in between Trump 1 and Trump 2 and they did nothing to tell a story which counters the fascist othering of LGBT, brown and immigrant people (which will expand to “the left” , then anyone who disagrees with anything they say, and then finally members of their own club, as fascism always does). The GOP have changed the game, and the Dems are still playing by the old rules. Until someone like Bernie or AOC gets control, the actual quickest way out of the current tragedy is to let fascism eat itself, a process that may cost literally millions of lives. But sadly, voting in a Democrat gov is no longer a way to avoid this.
Ok, fine - everyone who didn’t vote is irresponsible and unreliable and a bad ally or whatever, and also let’s do Fox News’ work for them and blame left-leaning emancipatory movements for our problems.
Now what? What viable allies, what options, does this frame of reference leave you with? What are you going to do now?
I’ve spent a lifetime watching people blame the ones closest to them for their problems, while the real enemy is right in front of them. It’s a powerful human impulse, and it’s the primary right-wing impulse. I’m not foolish enough to think it’s ever going away. I can only hope, like I hope of right-wingers, that you’re not too far gone into rage and despair to understand what’s going on.
I can only hope that at some point, before it’s too late, you’ll consider how far a political establishment needs to fall that the people it’s supposed to stand for find it less depressing to tune out; that the only people who engage with the system do it to bring in a guy who’ll tear it all down. I hope you’ll be able to direct your rage at the people who truly deserve it.
I hope you find a way to work with the rest of us. Otherwise, I hope that you’re strong enough to fix this yourself.
That’s a lot to say people shouldn’t be held accountable.
Sure, let’s hold the victims of fascism accountable for the actions of fascists.
If you’d actually read my comment, you would have realized that you’re demonstrating exactly what I was talking about. You want to hold fascists accountable, but you don’t have the immediate means to do that. So you turn around and victim-blame your fellow sufferers.
You’re not the first person to fall into this trap. It’s the entire reason people voted for Trump - if you can’t change the system that’s screwing you over, at least you can punish the people around you and call that accountability. I hope we can be smart enough not to do this to each other, but the responses in this thread are making it hard to be optimistic.
So, ironically, I’m going to tune out of this conversation too, before it crushes me even more. I’m going to try to find hope and courage elsewhere, because I’m all out of it at the moment. To the rest of you, whoever you are, I hope you can find it too.
No shit.
Hey assholes - this is what the “worse of two evils” looks like! Remember it for the next time, if you get a chance again.
I would love to know how many people actually refused to vote for Kamala for the reasons you stated. Obviously it’s not zero, but I have seen some variation of the “are you happy now?” comment hundreds of times, and I’ve never spoken to such a protest voter in real life. Or maybe they’re everywhere and they’re too embarrassed to admit it.
Instead of pointing to gerrymandering, voter suppression and potential massive election fraud, the mass of comments like yours is starting to feel like straw manning.
My dude, look at the replies to my comments. These people are outing themselves.
Guilty conscious maybe?
Of course they would be more hush hush about their fuck up now. Who but the most imbecilic narcissists would say gleefully as minorities are being shipped end masse to concentration camps that they intentionally refused to act to stop it?
Well, it was all worth it because something something “status quo” and we’d have a genocide in Gaza, or something.
I will always understand having grievances for the democratic party because all they do is defend the status quo - I do too - but not voting over that is just fucking stupid. You want to change that? Go to protests, vote in primaries, support local initiatives for ranked choice voting, donate to causes you find actually beneficial, support local politicians that dont just support the status quo, support movements you believe in. If its about Gaza, speak up about that, donate to humanitarian funds, etc. There are ao many things you can do that can impact these things. But refusing to vote does actually fucking nothing for that cause.
There is no world in which more people refusing to vote for Kamala would have gotten us a better president or stopped genocide in gaza. Or really had any impact in any way that wasn’t making trump more likely to win. IMO the folks that did that were doing it more for themselves so they could feel morally superior because they didnt vote for the candidate that supported genocide or the “status quo” even though it literally never would have had any impact on either of those things.
(And let’s be real - trump is way worse for Gaza than Kamala would have been. I’m sure she wouldn’t have done enough, just like Biden, but at least there are voices in that party calling out Israel. Those voices fall far more deaf on this administration’s ears)
Yep, I could not agree more. Seeing the smug and the self-righteous still proudly argle-bargling about Gaza is infuriating, if you ask me. I don’t know how many genuinely feel this way when it’s online - many could just be paid Russian stooges or bots, for all I know.
But I do know a few IRL and when it comes up, it’s hard to keep my cool. It’d be one thing if they didn’t act so goddamned morally superior about it all. I’ve noticed that all of the ones I know of IRL are not in at-risk groups, other than a few cases being women and some being not active xtians (but raised xtian), if that counts. But all of them are white, all of them are at least middle class, none are gay/trans…probably most have the means to get the fuck out of this country if they really had to, etc.
The Gazan War was so cynically manipulated to votes against Harris that it makes you think if that was all planned too.
I mean… It kinda was. Netanyahu deliberately stalled peace talks because he wanted Trump in power and he knew that killing Palestinians only hurt Kamala politically, it never hurt Trump because his voters don’t give a shit.
this is not a war, it’s been America helping the colonial occupation empty its largest concentration camp
they could have just stopped sending unlimited bombs to that genocidal occupation, but they chose to anyways in spite of all evidence that it was going to cost them the election.
They preferred losing the election to telling netanyahu no.
I mean we did all witness how maintaining support for Israel was deemed more important.
But then how will they learn?! /s
Virtue Signalling leftists when boycotting voting for Hillary didn’t turn the Dems left so why the fuck would boycotting Kamala do it?
Every year the DNC says “we got less votes this year! Must be the centrists voting for republicans, we gotta be more moderate!” and then somehow those folks turn around and say “the democrats are too moderate, if enough of us don’t vote, the DNC will see they are losing support and realize they need to come back left!”
Hillary explicitly told the left that she didn’t need their votes… I guess, in hindsight, she was wrong.
Irrelevant to what I said. Reread it.
As leftists, we need to act in the best interests of the working class. If that means electing an arrogant cunt over a demented fascist, that means electing an arrogant cunt over a demented fascist.
The left refusing to vote for Hillary in 2016 didn’t move the party left. We didn’t get Bernie, we got Biden.
Why? Because a fascist presidency didn’t make people think “hey, we need a real progressive for real change”, it made people scared and panic vote for who they perceived was the “safest” vote, which was Biden.
History will repeat itself (assuming we even have a fair enough election in 2028, let alone 2026).
americans are stupid, a side-effect of decades of neglecting their primary and secondary education systems, they will only learn through direct personal pain…and now that pain is coming.
the best move to support/protect those effected, and to make sure they know whose helping them and whose out to get them
you’re not a leftist if you’re actively choosing to advocate and vote for the Liberal presidential candidate. -That makes you a liberal, again, not a leftist.
Leftists actually cared enough about the working class and all marginalized persons that they actually bothered to research what the best viable option was for those groups, and accurately determined it was Kamala.
Fake leftist virtue signalling pansies who’s support for such groups is entirely hollow and self serving on an almost narcissistic level instead boycotted voting for Kamala and quire literally bent over and gaped wide to allow fascists to win the election.
The only fake leftists here are you.
It is your legacy that you spoke for no one when it mattered most. Not ours.
Why is this stupidity still being repeated? God, I’m so tired of refuting it. I’m just gonna start calling you stupid and move on.
.ml, of course lol
Just like you did when you passively voted for Trump and your local GOP representatives. What a surprise!
Literally all of those people are russian/chinese agitators and you got agitated.
Lesson: make an effort to not get agitated. Learn to meditate or something. You can still have convictions and even get angry, but get angry when needed, not when somebody deliberately makes you angry.
Lemmy is not really big enough yet to attract Russian trolls.
Perhaps this is a conspiracy theory, but it looks to me like Lemmy was built by Russian and/or Chinese trolls specifically to agitate people against the West. They haven’t been attracted to be here, they have been here from the start.
it was created by @[email protected] maybe they’re a Russian troll? I don’t think they are, but you could ask them :)
Your conspiracy isn’t true, mine is!
I’m trans and I didn’t vote for Kamala. Blue state, not like it even mattered. I have zero regrets about it on my part either. Since then all the liberals seem to be busy meeting the moment with capitulation and self-censorship, it’s clear they were never allies. I don’t care if I end up in a concentration camp, fuck this rancid ass country.
I’m trans and wish you wouldn’t project your not caring onto the rest of us. It only serves to show that you probably haven’t experienced anything even remotely close to concentration camps or the related dangers. I did not happily do it with a smile on my face, but I voted for Kamala because I knew that this exact thing would happen if Trump were elected. It was incredibly obvious. Gaza is even more fucked, even more bombed, gestapo is roaming the streets, and we’re actively discussing our community potentially getting sent to concentration camps.
But you decided to not even try to prevent it. You decided that because Kamala wouldn’t completely stop the genocide in Gaza, that Gaza, immigrants, trans people, and minorities should all suffer even more.
I’m not sure how you still feel good about your protest vote (being in a blue state doesn’t excuse it, either. You do not vote in a vacuum, especially when you talk about it online). If we ever get to vote again, I really hope you make better choices and don’t get caught up on a single issue. You should be able to choose the lesser of two evils, because if Kamala were elected, we would be in a better position to make actual, valuable change for things like Gaza, trans rights, and progressive reform. Obviously, we can’t know how much better of a position, but I can guarantee we would at least not be discussing how we’re going to be sent to the camps.
I get that our community is hurting. Please don’t make it worse for us because you’re apathetic.
hi, I ended up here in the US as a result of a right wing coup in my home country. I have had relatives with first hand experience of war, civil war, famine. it’s not something I take lightly which is why I am so appalled at the Democrats treating Palestinians like they’re expendible.
We don’t have a popular vote, due to how the system is arranged my vote hasn’t once mattered in decades of electoral participation. You’re kidding yourself about the influence of the fediverse if you think my comments had any impact.
I’m apathetic about voting, I’m actually extremely active organizing in my community against this shit. I find the people scolding about votes while doing fuck-all otherwise to be the ones making it worse.
It’s okay to be appalled, it’s normal. I’m appalled too. But because of our shitty, two party system, you are basically made to choose between the lesser of two evils in swing states. Choosing to not vote, or to vote for another party risks this exact outcome. While your vote in your state may not have had a direct impact (I’m willing to relent on that for now), what you say online (Lemmy or otherwise) or in person can convince someone in a swing state to also be apathetic, and that’s what hurts. It only has to affect one other person in a swing state, and then they’ll also spread their apathy to other voters in the state. It’s not a huge logical leap to consider.
When I say that you’re apathetic, I’m only talking about your voting habits. I know nothing else about you or what you do. I’m also not sure how trying to show how this behavior could result in our current situation is “making it worse”. I’m not trying to be insulting here, but if this apathy continues for the midterms (if they actually happen), it could very well convince some people to also not give a shit. I don’t want others in states where it really does matter to see your comments and think it’s all good to become entirely apathetic.
What really got to me was your comment about not caring about getting sent to the camps. Your relatives experiencing pain and trauma is one thing, but to experience concentration camps yourself is another thing entirely. You saying you don’t care about that could also be seen as you saying that you don’t care about the rest of the community being sent there, as well.
I’m not sure I buy the apathy contagion theory, I have a hard time believing anyone is actually swayed by me.
frankly the comment about not caring about getting sent to the camps was mostly being edgy to the guy doing the vote scolding like it even makes a difference now. maybe the Democrats would have been less bad overall, but after their past actions I have no reason to expect that Palestinians would be any better off under them.
my vote is a no-confidence vote in this shitty system and if supporting trans people becomes no longer politically expedient I fully expect that Democrats would cut us loose too.
People can be swayed by you without you ever knowing it, or even without them really even realizing it.
We can’t ever know if dems would’ve been much better because we lost that chance, but the GOP literally campaigns on being pro-genocide, so we knew where they stood on the issue beforehand. And we got even more confirmation of that now.
Similarly, we knew that the GOP would do everything they could to villify and condemn trans people. At least the dems didn’t fully campaign on it. Since you’re in a blue state, I wonder if you have protections that trans people in red states do not? I sure do, in my blue state. The dems here didn’t just talk about improving trans rights and protecting us, they actually did it, and have continued to do so. They did the same thing for abortion rights. Of course, not without massive complaints from the local GOP.
The democrats ran on a year+ of genocide, I have no confidence that they would suddenly have a change of heart afterwards.
The democrats in my state do in fact pass some protections, but do basically nothing about the fundamental economic and housing inequalities that make it almost impossible for red state trans people to safely relocate there. If you’re someone who can hustle enough to afford to live here it’s relatively safe, but despite all that we still have plenty of right wing democrats triangulating over things like womens sports.
I’m trans and I very much care about not ending up in a concentration camp, please. (And yes I voted for Harris, but for the love of God can we take over the primaries next time, so the neoliberals are the ones holding their nose and voting?)
it would be nice if they actually decide to have primaries next time, I’m not holding out hope that elections are going to save us
Absolute alpha tough guy here
I’m none of those descriptors, I just didnt vote for the genocidal shitheads
It was never about being allies with the liberals. It was ALWAYS about choosing the best VIABLE choice for the working class, for minorities, for women, for our planet.
And y’all dropped the fucking ball.
Even in a garunteed blue state, action I spires action. Discourse even to just a handful, has an echoing effect to someone who can male a difference. But you lot lack any strategic vision or foresight.
Spoken like someone who hasn’t experienced real danger and doesn’t even comprehend the real danger their in.
If it means anything, I don’t give a fuck what happens to you specifically either. I give a fuck about the millions of innocent people who are now damned to death and suffering. And all of it could’ve been avoided if more leftists were actual fucking adults and observed the reality before them last November.
It was the democrats participating in a genocide for over a year in advance of the election that had the ‘echoing effect’ of making people not want to vote for their disgusting asses. Just being realistic, a trans anarchist in a blue state not voting for bomber harris has literally zero impact on how anyone else voted.
You’re the one acting like scolding people over votes while the gestapo is roaming the streets is accomplishing anything
They’re not credible opposition.
The Dems were also the only party that hosted any politicians in power who opposed the genocide.
Does the GOP have any that oppose the genocide (outside of the JQ like with MTG)? No.
Was Biden and Kamala gearing to mass deport and arrest anti-genocide activists and demonstrators? No.
Did Biden and Kamala give Netanyahu the greenlight to fully annex Palestine, and expand the war to include all of their neighbors, Iran and Yemen? No.
You have to be TRULY delusional to think the genocide is about the same now as it was under Biden.
You people couldn’t, for even a moment imagine it getting worse, even as the entire GOP was painting the picture for you in front of your face. Now its worse, exactly as everyone with a functional brain could for see.
Your lack of strategic vision and foresight, and let’s be real your completely hollow virtue signalling for faux support, is your problem that you’ve made other peoples’ problems.
Just being a realist, action inspires action. Complete apathy towards the issue “because I live in a blue state” objectively had an echoing effect onto swing states with other potential blue voters. You aren’t escaping culpability with your cope.
You’re the ones who refused to act when it mattered most and was most easy to do so.
I’m scolding you because you people enabled this shit to happen to begin with to feed your egos.
No one who opposes fascism should ever turn to you, or anyone else who participated in the virtue signal boycott, for alliance against fascism. You are untrustworthy and unreliable.
But hey, cope to protect your ego harder 🤡🤡🤡🤡 Again, I’m sure the feeling you got from virtue signalling is worth the end of any semblance of safety for you and everyone you love.
Not you totally missing the point
Y’all ain’t credible allies, antifascists, or even anarchists for that matter
yeah but your point of view doesn’t count because it doesn’t fit within their narrow, convenient narrative.
It’s time to get over it and look to the future. She lost. Talking shit isn’t helping anybody but you.
Actually I think it’s vitally important that voters learn from this. Or you’ll all be doomed to repeat this mistake again in the future, if you get the chance that is.
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Edit: better?
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I’m not a political party, or in charge of anything.
Maybe you should direct your anger somewhere useful, like at those who were in power, or those who are seeking it.
Or not, you do you buddy.