I really liked Andor, but that’s because it was trying to be a political spy thriller first, and a star wars show second.
Most Disney Star Wars is really in love with the fact that its Star Wars, to the point that it feels like a child smashing their toys together, than an actual show or movie
Disney Star Wars is really in love with the fact that its Star Wars, to the point that it feels like a child smashing their toys together
Mood.
In a similar vein, I’ve been calling anything post-buyout as “Disney fanfiction”. Some fanfiction is great! But it’s not canon.
Trek, baby.
ay, they hate each other too. XD same shit, different galaxy. XD
but if you can enjoy it, then definitely do so! i’m excited for Academy! and SNW is always rockin.
Sounds like something a borg would say. Bitch. 👍
no idea what you’re saying.
Me thirty years ago. In 1977 my entire life revolved around Star Wars. Still haven’t seen the last movie
Same. 8 was such a ridiculous clusterfuck of a film that I lost all interest in seeing 9.
I can’t believe I am saying this, but I am starting to enjoy Star Trek way more than SW (and I really was a fan of SW in my childhood).
Not hating on Star Trek, because I love both franchises.
What’s a Star Wars?
All facetiousness aside, I liked the movies, but they’re not my personality.
Same with Sherlock, Star Trek, Lord Of The Rings, Critical Role, Apple products, Wie Is De Mol, etc.
I like them, may even love them, but my whole world does not revolve around them.sorry, i’m too busy enjoying The High Republic. but farewell to you!
Simple. Star Wars has 6 episodes, and that’s it. The rest is odd fan fiction that happens to be filmed in Hollywood. Now, enjoy!
Three, actually. They never got around to making 1-3
They made more star wars after 1977?
the One, True Star Wars fan. XD
Star War fan
I spy an old, but respectable man
wait, i’ve seen this one before!
What’s a rerun?
Simple. Star Wars has 3 episodes, and that’s it. The rest is odd fan fiction that happens to be filmed in Hollywood. Now, enjoy!
circa 2000.
I’m not so sure you got the joke. You made a Back to the Future reference so I followed up with another one.
Andor
You know it’s even better, realizing that other people’s opinion doesn’t matter about Star wars only what you feel about it. I don’t give a fuck that somebody doesn’t like something that I like because guess what I like it so y’all can fuck off.
I like everything Star Wars. Except the kid’s shows, of course. Didn’t even watch those. But everything else I’ve seen, almost.
Honestly? The kids cartoons are kind of a beacon of good storytelling in Star Wars, nowadays.
Obviously they’re for children, and some arcs are boring filler, so YMMV, but they’re also able to tell these smaller, off the beaten path, stories that you don’t get elsewhere.
I said this in another comment that Star War’s big problem has been that It’s very in love with itself. It’s a self-referential fever dream that feels more like a child smashing their toys together, than a real show.
So ironically, the shows for children don’t have that problem quite so much. For instance, there’s an episode of The Bad Batch where a bunch of miners rise up and kill their boss. That shit rules! That’s a fun story that happens to take place in the Star Wars universe, and isn’t concerned with the fact that it’s Star Wars
When I say kid’s shows, I’m not really talking about The Bad Batch. That show cut deep into me as an adult with my own children. That show is not for kids.
No, I mean more stuff like these template cookie cutter Disney shows, like Star Wars: Young Jedi Adventures. Those are utterly not interesting at all, and I don’t consider them canon for my own sanity of not feeling like I need to watch them. 😄
My kids watched some episodes of that show while I was listening in from the side, and it could’ve just as easily been an episode of literally any other kid’s show, like Paw Patrol or something, but with a Star Wars theme to it. Same basic messages as any American kid’s show. And a bit overly tailored towards an American audience as well, specifically. Not really looking to subject my children to that. 🙅♂️
It’s sad. For almost ten years people have argued about what went wrong with Star Wars.
Too many genres? The EU was scattershot and unfocused at times, but never hurt the brand in a significant way. In fact, it led to some great books and games
Too much politics? The villain of TPM is named after Newt Gingrich, and nobody really cared. ANH was inspired by Vietnam, and was still a box office hit.
The fanbase hates (insert minority)? While the internet has magnified the extreme weirdos, all six films have some mix of assertive female leads and non-white characters. Lando blew up the Death Star, Mace Windu was considered second only to Yoda. Every clone, etc. Still had a successful brand. Clone Wars focused hard on the clones and is put above the prequels by many of the hardcore fans. This isn’t to say there aren’t awful people who acted unhinged, but that goes for basically every large group of people in human history, let alone fandoms on the internet.
The answer is quality of writing. The originals were written well, and had coherent world building. The prequels struggled with character writing and general complexity, which is why they are more divisive. Good writing is the difference between the comedy of C-3PO and Jar Jar. It’s the difference between Luke and Rey. And it’s the difference between soul and slop.
The people at Disney either don’t understand this, or don’t care. It is an organization of Nico Harrisons who don’t understand the fundamentals of their industry. This pattern has been repeating across pop culture since the 2010’s, and was blamed on culture war instead of the real issue. It’s a miracle that something like Rogue One or Andor was ever greenlit.
Also, did you know the box office drop-off between 4 and 5 is the same, down to the percentage point, as the drop-off between 7 and 8? And yet, 5 is the most beloved, while 8 had so much backlash that Disney panicked and turned 9 into damage control, instead of working off of 8.
The difference? ESB is well written. TLJ broke space combat entirely for a cool visual. I don’t want to absolve TFA, which gets off way too easy because of what followed, but this comment is already too long…
It wasn’t just panic over fan backlash that made them screw up 9. 8 basically left them nothing to work with to get to the ending they wanted. Especially with the tragic loss of Carrie Fisher, who was meant to be the central character of 9.
That was down to a critical lack of planning.
the difference is only that toxic fandom has the bullhorn of the internet now. that’s it. that’s the only difference.
No, that’s the shitty excuse Disney executives like to hide behind. “PEOPLE ARE JUST MAD WE FEATURED A WOMAN/BLACK PERSON/GAY COUPLE!”
No, people are mad because your writing is shit. Most people are actually A-OK with minority characters, as long as you give them a reason to like the characters. (Except China, but Disney knew that so they made sure they didn’t feature the problematic black character over there). Make them interesting, don’t make them a Mary Sue, don’t build their plot up only to yank it away at the last second and turn them into just another background character.
But no, Disney can’t do that because they are terrified of trying new things. So they made the blandest, most milquetoast, characters possible and made the plot Baby’s-First-Starwars in the first sequel, took what the fans loved about Star Wars and literally burnt it in front of them in the second sequel (while telling fans they were stupid to ever like that part of Star Wars in the first place), and then backtracked HARD into Baby’s-First-Starwars again in the third sequel when they were shocked to discover that fans didn’t like being insulted.
So many issues with the sequels, complete corporate ignorance to just chalk it up to a “toxic fandom”.
whomever you’re talking to, it isn’t me.
It sure is! Don’t get mad when someone holds a mirror up to you making the same pathetic excuses Disney does for their failures.
Nope, I remember the absolute vitriol directed at the George Lucas-written prequels, and even actors themselves; and Disney wasn’t involved in those.
2009 was more than a decade ago, but I remember the Red Letter Media review like it was yesterday https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Letter_Media
i’m sorry you’re so confused. i hope you find peace.
I dunno if Disney cares much about the writing so long as the property makes money. It’s hard to determine the cash return on streaming shows, though the viewership numbers definitely point towards a trend. Disney likes to characterize the production process as a product in an of itself, but subscribers are unlikely don’t translate that into viewership past the first couple episodes 🤷♂️
Let me blow this wide open. I don’t think anything went wrong with it, there was just too much Star Wars and I stopped caring. The same with Marvel stuff , I watched it all and then bam I couldn’t be bothered to watch Endgame and I haven’t watched any since. And I’ve always been more of a Trekkie. I watched every single episode of every season of every Star Trek but I just can’t be arsed to watch the last seasons of New Worlds, it is fine but I have had my fill. Or maybe I got old and it just doesn’t do it for me any more?
I have watched every single Star Wars movie in theatres since I was a kid and they released the special editions in theatres. But last Jedi was so bad that I didn’t even bother to go see rise of skywalker. Not just in theatres, i still haven’t watched it to this day.
so you haven’t watched every single star wars movie in theatres since you were a kid
how will you learn how palpatine came back for reasons now?
You’re not missing out, in my opinion it was not a good movie in any sense.
I thought the first movie of the new trilogy was actually pretty good though.
There are valid criticisms of it but it was all around a solid start to the next chapter of the franchise.
Then the last Jedi happened. Fuck that. And then whatever the rise of skywalker is. Oh emperor palpatine is alive again for no reason at all, woo.
If they’d have just kept the expanded universe canon and moved forward with that then everything would have been fine. But no. Let’s have an aggressive needlessly secretive admiral lady ram a starship, because “believe women” somehow also means “women are incapable of lying” or whatever the fuck the point of that idiocy was.
It’s just so fucking bad.
I used to do a little camera work. #7 has my favorite shot/camera angle of the entire franchise. they told a lot of that story visually.
That’s a new take I can appreciate. Thanks actually
Well, someone had to since the script writers didn’t.
People disagree on this often. I thought 7-8-9 was shit. However 8 was a special kind of shit. I think half of the movie was really good. The other half of it, was absolute dogshit. At least it wasn’t a “'memba” fest like 7 and 9. It tried to do original stuff, but it fucked up royally on the pursuit / canto arcs. And I’m not even talking about the hyperspace ramming.
However the Luke + Rey + Kylo arcs were genius. People hate it for the old man drinking aliencowtitjuice and being a bitter old man and for his sacrifice, but it’s actually very characteristic of him. And the mystery of Rey’s past and her connection with Kylo is very well done and explores things never seen before.
I wonder what the story behind this is. And whether Johnson had to make concessions for Disney.
If that is what is characteristic of Luke Skywalker, then they certainly changed the character and the fan page is it is appropriate.
Throwing out the Literary Extended Universe, but kinda of sort of keeping elements of it is what has made it so bad.
There were really important things that happened in the world in the LEU. Which continues establishing who the characters and the world of Star wars.
It’s should be no surprise the fan base is so divided. If you have only seen that Han Shot First that gives you a very different perspective on Han Solo. If you have read about Mara Jade, or C’Boath, Grand Admiral Thrawn, the Katana Fleet then having their names spoken in the cinematic universe gives you a very different vision of what’s going on on screen because you have a or existing understanding that you can’t just forget about us they don’t actually explain who those people are in the on screen version of them.
Lucas never should have licenced stories that were not going to be okay if the cannon, then go ahead and steal the names of those non canon characters or events if he didn’t want to fracture the fanbase. But they did and now it’s a mess.
That being said there is now opportunity to do Star wars legends movies since they already disassociated those stories from canonical Star wars, which is great and they should absolutely do that.
Same here
I don’t think anyone hates Star Wars more than Star Wars fans.
honestly, Disney’s treatment of the franchise killed my life long love for it
Lucas had already taken it out to the woodshed several times.
The franchise has historically been at its best in the fallow years, when people were just tapping into the IP to tell their own stories.
But you can say the same of Trek, of Harry Potter, of Marvel and DCU. Any time the suits take over, content trends towards slop
Agreed… however, I do have a specially dark and bitter place in my heart for Disney. They have a rotten touch and ruin every IP they buy
I mean, I generally like their original work. Moana, Lilo and Stitch, The Incredibles, Zootopia - all very entertaining, creative, and packed with talented performances.
And they can even make solid kids action movies. Disenchanted, Hocus Pocus, the original Pirates of the Caribbean, Tron - it’s clearly within the capacity of the studio to make good films.
When they buy up these outside franchises and “Disney-fy” them, though… Woof.
I thought Incredibles predated the Disney takeover? Otherwise I agree
disenchanted was disney? i thought that was primarily a groening project.
Disenchanted, the movie. Not the Netflix cartoon. The feature length movie is a sequel to Enchanted, a live-action parody of the traditional Disney Princess trope.
there’s also a movie with the same name, not to be confused with the Groening/Netflix show.
LucasArts did some of the best Star Wars games. I loved Jedi Outcast, best jedi experience out there, and X-Wing Alliance thanks to the amount of ships the game gave you
The last Star Wars movie I enjoyed was Jedi: Survivor.
Ironically, the last Indiana Jones movie I enjoyed was Indiana Jones and the Great Circle.
so you prefer cinematic games to movies? no criticism, that’s just what it looks like. me too.
It’s total happenstance that the best stories told in those worlds have come from game developers. Making those stories interactive as well as cinematic is an entire extra layer of difficulty upon the creative process, and they cleared that hurdle too.
Jedi Survivor even made the struggle of staying human, confronting anger (and the dark side), and the fight for survival far more nuanced and well-written than the third trilogy did.
