While going for another program, ideally non proprietary, with a native Linux version would be ideal, I would not be surprised if running Photoshop on Linux with wine was a viable option these days. Or will be in a not-too-distant future.
As for games, what the others have said. Unless you’re into a specific multiplier game with a kernel level “anticheat”, then it should be fine.
In fact, I suspect Photoshop, rather than gaming, is much more likely to be the reason you’d have to dual boot.
Don’t know if this is particularly relevant as a comparison to your Photoshop idea, but I have successfully run things like windows version of Cascadeur and Blender through Proton; in the case of Blender, it was for running an older Kenshi modding import export plugin, which only supports the Windows version of Blender.
Literally just set it up through Steam, Proton Experimental.
UI scaling / fonts can be a bit wonky, but for just doing the import/export steps, its totally workable, as… a .blend file is a .blend file, so you can do the other edits in a linux version of Blender.
Or, I could probably use ProtonTricks to add some fonts and font subpixel AA dependencies to get it to work ‘more right’, I remember that being what I ended up doing back when I was still using MO2.
Or, or, you could try Bottles, that would probably be a more sane way to try and set up a more… fully featured, editor type of Windows program, within Linux, it tends to handle those kinds of esoteric dependencies a bit better, has more of them as just part of the default preset.
Holy shit, doing all that for an old Kenshi plugin is just fantastic, you genuinely got a laugh out of me. I did think people who played Kenshi seemed like masochists (or very zen and meditative people) but thanks for the confirmation.
I initially thought something like that, but another comment mentions a bunch of potential Adobe cloud + DRM bullshit that may or may not make the wine/proton approach range from impossible to quite a bit broken.
I would not describe setting that up as masochistic, it was actually quite easy, easier than figuring out how to install Windows on the hardware I have, without blowing up everything else.
Dual booting linux and windows?
That’s masochism.
… I actually was a karateka for a decade +, so, perhaps i am some combination of meditative and masochistic, by some people’s standards.
I very much appreciate the extent to which Kenshi is not a power fantasy, the extent to which … it allows you to become OP as fuck and do many incredible things… but you have to actually earn it.
Anyway, yes, the DRM is probably your main problem there with Adobe, … I dunno, find a crack or use Krita or Gimp or other alternatives?
At least personally, I find that those two do everything I need, there are basically only super niche scenarios where linux does not have an at least comparably featured alternative to some windows software.
I recently got a local LLM spun up… on my Steam Deck. Running Bazzite.
Literally so easy I did it without a mouse or keyboard.
Ah it seems you have me confused, I’m not the guy who needs Photoshop.
Interestingly, I have been dual booting Linux and windows for a while in the past. That was way, way back though, around 2010 I’d say. Back then, gaming on Linux was still very much hit and miss (but mostly miss, for me) and I had nothing better to do than gaming after uni so I did not have much of a choice.
I’ll say, maybe it was dumb luck, more likely it’s Windows getting shitter, but dual booting used to be much less of a faff from what I can gather. For instance I never had a windows update torch my boot record to force itself instead of grubby grub. I understand that can be a common occurrence these days.
After that and getting a real job TM, I had much less time for it so I wiped that sad excuse for an OS from my system with a grin and never looked back. Which also means, there’s been a decent chunk of time I only did with whatever was available in Linux as I could not be bothered with wine. So I don’t know how easy things have become, my only exposure is now the odd bit of gaming again but, as you know, Steam just makes it work for me.
+1 for Krita, I don’t need much but it more than fits the bill for me. There are other threads in there though that do mention some stuff is just a lot harder when compared to PS for peeps who are actually good at the stuff.
LLMs (ok ok,not local) now come by default on Windows, without keyboard or mouse, just the mandatory connection to the mothership. So, yay windows?
I would not be surprised if running Photoshop on Linux with wine was a viable option these days. Or will be in a not-too-distant future.
Thats basically what I was trying to respond to initially.
I’m use lemmy on mobile, and sometimes the sort of thread branches become a confusing rainbow of … wait who am I talking to?
But anyway yeah, I used to be able to dual boot linux and windows fairly easily, but then, MSFT decided that their idea of Secure Boot involves rewriting your GRUB or whatever, and breaking your bootloader / boot sector.
And it would do this via Windows updates.
So thats a rootkit, as far as I’m concerned, fuck em, get off my PC.
IRT local LLMs, that aren’t spyware, that are containerized, that don’t burn down an acre of forest for every 15 minutes their datacenter runs?
Alpaca. Its a flatpak, makes setting up a local LLM about as easy at it could possibly be.
IRT to Kenshi…
Seek not the “wisdom” of Okran, for he is a false god, a cruel god, his “Holy Nation” is an abominable pox, a viscious hypocrisy manifest in blood stained sand and broken souls.
Instead, seek the meek, foster them, and your rewards shall be numerous and unexpected.
… ahem …
Uh yeah Kenshi has as almost much lore and worldbuilding as something like a Bethesda game, but it does have a very unorthodox sort of control scheme.
Its… kind of like playing on old school, SWG/MxO era MMO, but its… singleplayer, and … basically a simulation of a world, more so than a ‘game’ with a coherent main plot.
You just have to go find the plotlines, the people with backstories, the factions with conflicts.
You can be a fighter, a thief, a caravaneer, you can build a town, you can raise an army, and lead them all into battle.
Its unorthodox, if you need a game to handhold you and direct you, you probably won’t like Kenshi.
But if you want a confusing and brutal world that is entirely capable of existing and functioning without you… you might like it.
Ah I did say that, but as an answer to the post above who wondered whether a dual boot would be needed for PS.
So what I heard is true. Yep, shitty practice from MS. In other news, water makes you wet.
No no obviously windows would not support that. It provides some value, and respects the user.
You do make it sound good, I just think I am sadly no longer at a point in my life where I can reasonably dedicate the chunk of time that would be needed to get into it. Maybe I’ll change my mind. Thank you for the enthusiastic write up!
In my understanding, still no, especially not the more advanced filters stuff. PS6 (or whatever the last one you could actually buy was) on the other hand is 95+% functional if you can go back. Not an expert, GIMP is fine for my needs, there’s even a spin with PS-like menu layout if that’s your jam, but happy to be told I’m wrong about new PS.
Adobe shit and AutoCAD stuff are the the last major sticking points these days, Office is in the cloud now. Shame these last two won’t let their cash cows be rented in the cloud (instead of subscribed, you know, a long term rental agreement using your own computer) to my knowledge. There’s always VMs.
Ah, that’s good to know. I wonder why that is.
I don’t use these programs beyond the odd very simple image manipulation that could be done just as easily in paint, so I have no idea what people want from Photoshop alternative. However, I seem to keep hearing no single open source program does everything from people who are PS power users.
Don’t get me started on AutoCAD, and just CAD tools in general… Being more involved on that side, from a dev rather than user perspective, I can’t say I think very highly of Autodesk, or the idea of having all these geometry kernels be proprietary, and Autodesk acquiring as many of them as it can. Maths is public, maths research belongs to the public, you can fuck off with gating it.
As for VMs, we are talking about apps that need a relatively good GPU and therefore one would need to do some GPU pass through on their VM to use it properly I believe. Assuming I’m right, that may be more trouble than it’s worth compared to a dual boot (also assuming this hasn’t gotten much simpler than my somewhat distant memory now)
Modern versions of Photoshop are deeply integrated with another software called Adobe Cloud. As in, you can’t even install Photoshop by itself, it needs to be installed and managed via Adobe cloud, which has to constantly be running in the background for Photoshop to work (and it wouldn’t surprise me if it’s some kernel level BS, knowing Adobe). They are also reliant on other Adobe online services for some tools and services, and not just the generative AI ones.
That’s usually what causes a lot of hangups I believe. For example, if you need to connect your Photoshop to your client’s Adobe cloud or share files through it, or maybe connect Photoshop to other Adobe products like Indesign or After Effects, that may not work properly. This even applies to pirated versions of Photoshops on windows, where a lot of the patching comes from blocking Adobe’s constant interference with the program as it’s running, but as a result several tools may end up not working.
As for stuff people want from Photoshop, this is anecdotal from me but I primary use Photoshop to letter things and literally no other program that runs on Linux even comes close to the simplicity and versatility Photoshop gives me for lettering with its type tool. It is just so simple to configure text the way I want to and there are so many ways to modify it. Clip Studio Paint is the second best contender (makes sense since it used to be primarily a comic creation software) but, shocker, it doesn’t run on Linux either.
Every open source tool I tried, Gimp and Krita included, is so many miles behind in this department that I thought I had returned to the stone age when I tried using them for this purpose earlier this year. Krita didn’t even have a live preview of the text I was writing. It was completely unusable for my more advanced needs.
This is why I just tell people who use Photoshop and Adobe that want to switch to Linux to just accept dual booting. It’s realistically the only thing that won’t constantly lead to headaches with the software.
I have to use illustrator for work sometimes. I used to dual boot, now I use winboat. It’s a bit of a pain to set up initially but it works well once you’ve done that
Thank you so much for the detailed answer. I was not aware of that level of BS on the Photoshop front, though that does not surprise me. I guess I’m showing my age a bit by remembering Photoshop to just be a standalone program without any of that “not that long ago”.
While going for another program, ideally non proprietary, with a native Linux version would be ideal, I would not be surprised if running Photoshop on Linux with wine was a viable option these days. Or will be in a not-too-distant future.
As for games, what the others have said. Unless you’re into a specific multiplier game with a kernel level “anticheat”, then it should be fine.
In fact, I suspect Photoshop, rather than gaming, is much more likely to be the reason you’d have to dual boot.
Don’t know if this is particularly relevant as a comparison to your Photoshop idea, but I have successfully run things like windows version of Cascadeur and Blender through Proton; in the case of Blender, it was for running an older Kenshi modding import export plugin, which only supports the Windows version of Blender.
Literally just set it up through Steam, Proton Experimental.
UI scaling / fonts can be a bit wonky, but for just doing the import/export steps, its totally workable, as… a .blend file is a .blend file, so you can do the other edits in a linux version of Blender.
Or, I could probably use ProtonTricks to add some fonts and font subpixel AA dependencies to get it to work ‘more right’, I remember that being what I ended up doing back when I was still using MO2.
Or, or, you could try Bottles, that would probably be a more sane way to try and set up a more… fully featured, editor type of Windows program, within Linux, it tends to handle those kinds of esoteric dependencies a bit better, has more of them as just part of the default preset.
Holy shit, doing all that for an old Kenshi plugin is just fantastic, you genuinely got a laugh out of me. I did think people who played Kenshi seemed like masochists (or very zen and meditative people) but thanks for the confirmation.
I initially thought something like that, but another comment mentions a bunch of potential Adobe cloud + DRM bullshit that may or may not make the wine/proton approach range from impossible to quite a bit broken.
TL;DR Adobe is probably evil incarnate.
I would not describe setting that up as masochistic, it was actually quite easy, easier than figuring out how to install Windows on the hardware I have, without blowing up everything else.
Dual booting linux and windows?
That’s masochism.
… I actually was a karateka for a decade +, so, perhaps i am some combination of meditative and masochistic, by some people’s standards.
I very much appreciate the extent to which Kenshi is not a power fantasy, the extent to which … it allows you to become OP as fuck and do many incredible things… but you have to actually earn it.
Anyway, yes, the DRM is probably your main problem there with Adobe, … I dunno, find a crack or use Krita or Gimp or other alternatives?
At least personally, I find that those two do everything I need, there are basically only super niche scenarios where linux does not have an at least comparably featured alternative to some windows software.
I recently got a local LLM spun up… on my Steam Deck. Running Bazzite.
Literally so easy I did it without a mouse or keyboard.
… Can you do that on Windows?
heheheheh
Ah it seems you have me confused, I’m not the guy who needs Photoshop.
Interestingly, I have been dual booting Linux and windows for a while in the past. That was way, way back though, around 2010 I’d say. Back then, gaming on Linux was still very much hit and miss (but mostly miss, for me) and I had nothing better to do than gaming after uni so I did not have much of a choice.
I’ll say, maybe it was dumb luck, more likely it’s Windows getting shitter, but dual booting used to be much less of a faff from what I can gather. For instance I never had a windows update torch my boot record to force itself instead of grubby grub. I understand that can be a common occurrence these days.
After that and getting a real job TM, I had much less time for it so I wiped that sad excuse for an OS from my system with a grin and never looked back. Which also means, there’s been a decent chunk of time I only did with whatever was available in Linux as I could not be bothered with wine. So I don’t know how easy things have become, my only exposure is now the odd bit of gaming again but, as you know, Steam just makes it work for me.
+1 for Krita, I don’t need much but it more than fits the bill for me. There are other threads in there though that do mention some stuff is just a lot harder when compared to PS for peeps who are actually good at the stuff.
LLMs (ok ok,not local) now come by default on Windows, without keyboard or mouse, just the mandatory connection to the mothership. So, yay windows?
maybe I should try Kenshi sometime…
Oh.
Perhaps I am confused, though you did say:
Thats basically what I was trying to respond to initially.
I’m use lemmy on mobile, and sometimes the sort of thread branches become a confusing rainbow of … wait who am I talking to?
But anyway yeah, I used to be able to dual boot linux and windows fairly easily, but then, MSFT decided that their idea of Secure Boot involves rewriting your GRUB or whatever, and breaking your bootloader / boot sector.
And it would do this via Windows updates.
So thats a rootkit, as far as I’m concerned, fuck em, get off my PC.
IRT local LLMs, that aren’t spyware, that are containerized, that don’t burn down an acre of forest for every 15 minutes their datacenter runs?
Alpaca. Its a flatpak, makes setting up a local LLM about as easy at it could possibly be.
IRT to Kenshi…
Seek not the “wisdom” of Okran, for he is a false god, a cruel god, his “Holy Nation” is an abominable pox, a viscious hypocrisy manifest in blood stained sand and broken souls.
Instead, seek the meek, foster them, and your rewards shall be numerous and unexpected.
… ahem …
Uh yeah Kenshi has as almost much lore and worldbuilding as something like a Bethesda game, but it does have a very unorthodox sort of control scheme.
Its… kind of like playing on old school, SWG/MxO era MMO, but its… singleplayer, and … basically a simulation of a world, more so than a ‘game’ with a coherent main plot.
You just have to go find the plotlines, the people with backstories, the factions with conflicts.
You can be a fighter, a thief, a caravaneer, you can build a town, you can raise an army, and lead them all into battle.
Its unorthodox, if you need a game to handhold you and direct you, you probably won’t like Kenshi.
But if you want a confusing and brutal world that is entirely capable of existing and functioning without you… you might like it.
Ah I did say that, but as an answer to the post above who wondered whether a dual boot would be needed for PS.
So what I heard is true. Yep, shitty practice from MS. In other news, water makes you wet.
No no obviously windows would not support that. It provides some value, and respects the user.
You do make it sound good, I just think I am sadly no longer at a point in my life where I can reasonably dedicate the chunk of time that would be needed to get into it. Maybe I’ll change my mind. Thank you for the enthusiastic write up!
Ah hey that’s totally fair!
May you walk with purpose, but your steps be gentle.
In my understanding, still no, especially not the more advanced filters stuff. PS6 (or whatever the last one you could actually buy was) on the other hand is 95+% functional if you can go back. Not an expert, GIMP is fine for my needs, there’s even a spin with PS-like menu layout if that’s your jam, but happy to be told I’m wrong about new PS.
Adobe shit and AutoCAD stuff are the the last major sticking points these days, Office is in the cloud now. Shame these last two won’t let their cash cows be rented in the cloud (instead of subscribed, you know, a long term rental agreement using your own computer) to my knowledge. There’s always VMs.
Ah, that’s good to know. I wonder why that is. I don’t use these programs beyond the odd very simple image manipulation that could be done just as easily in paint, so I have no idea what people want from Photoshop alternative. However, I seem to keep hearing no single open source program does everything from people who are PS power users.
Don’t get me started on AutoCAD, and just CAD tools in general… Being more involved on that side, from a dev rather than user perspective, I can’t say I think very highly of Autodesk, or the idea of having all these geometry kernels be proprietary, and Autodesk acquiring as many of them as it can. Maths is public, maths research belongs to the public, you can fuck off with gating it.
As for VMs, we are talking about apps that need a relatively good GPU and therefore one would need to do some GPU pass through on their VM to use it properly I believe. Assuming I’m right, that may be more trouble than it’s worth compared to a dual boot (also assuming this hasn’t gotten much simpler than my somewhat distant memory now)
Modern versions of Photoshop are deeply integrated with another software called Adobe Cloud. As in, you can’t even install Photoshop by itself, it needs to be installed and managed via Adobe cloud, which has to constantly be running in the background for Photoshop to work (and it wouldn’t surprise me if it’s some kernel level BS, knowing Adobe). They are also reliant on other Adobe online services for some tools and services, and not just the generative AI ones.
That’s usually what causes a lot of hangups I believe. For example, if you need to connect your Photoshop to your client’s Adobe cloud or share files through it, or maybe connect Photoshop to other Adobe products like Indesign or After Effects, that may not work properly. This even applies to pirated versions of Photoshops on windows, where a lot of the patching comes from blocking Adobe’s constant interference with the program as it’s running, but as a result several tools may end up not working.
As for stuff people want from Photoshop, this is anecdotal from me but I primary use Photoshop to letter things and literally no other program that runs on Linux even comes close to the simplicity and versatility Photoshop gives me for lettering with its type tool. It is just so simple to configure text the way I want to and there are so many ways to modify it. Clip Studio Paint is the second best contender (makes sense since it used to be primarily a comic creation software) but, shocker, it doesn’t run on Linux either.
Every open source tool I tried, Gimp and Krita included, is so many miles behind in this department that I thought I had returned to the stone age when I tried using them for this purpose earlier this year. Krita didn’t even have a live preview of the text I was writing. It was completely unusable for my more advanced needs.
This is why I just tell people who use Photoshop and Adobe that want to switch to Linux to just accept dual booting. It’s realistically the only thing that won’t constantly lead to headaches with the software.
I have to use illustrator for work sometimes. I used to dual boot, now I use winboat. It’s a bit of a pain to set up initially but it works well once you’ve done that
Thank you so much for the detailed answer. I was not aware of that level of BS on the Photoshop front, though that does not surprise me. I guess I’m showing my age a bit by remembering Photoshop to just be a standalone program without any of that “not that long ago”.