Youāre assuming an awful lot about me based on complete ignorance and using those assumptions to justify a really bizarre level of abuse.
You donāt understand time zones or geopolitical history either it seems, and youāre imaging people from thousands of years ago to have a concept of universality.
Iām not. Thatās literally the premise of the idea proposed here. The fact that you donāt get that is really making me question your reading comprehension abilities.
Youāre not proposing a single improvement,
Correct. Iām not. As Iāve noted several times now, Iām not proposing anything. Iām just pointing out that we have a significant bias toward the system we already know.
Except it is, because thatās how hours work. You probably donāt know where they come from either
Yeah, they were chosen more or less arbitrarily by the ancient Egyptians because there were twelve significant constellations they followed, which led to a sort of base-12 number system they used for stuff related to the sky (months and hours in particular).
Again, units and numbers have no inherent meaning. We made it all up. A day could just as easily have had ten hours of 144 minutes each, or 40 hours of 36 minutes each.
I know it seems to you like youāre making sense, but youāre notā¦
The fact that you donāt understand what Iām saying doesnāt mean that Iām not making sense. And I think thereās ample evidence here that youāre just not reading carefully.
ā¦because youāre ignorant of so many assumptions youāve made, which if changed, would be like giving ancient Romans the GPS instead of them using sundials and that said Romans wouldāve magically been able to consider that theyre noon is two hours after āthe realā noon, which is based onā¦?
Ok. Deciphering your word salad here, I think youāre trying to suggest that our current 24-hour day and time zones were somehow inevitable? Whichā¦I mean, obviously they arenāt, since there are many cultures that independently came up with different time systems.
Thereās a Hindi clock that divides the day into thirty hours. Roman timekeeping was divided into 12 hours, but that time was measured from sunrise to sunset. Byzantine time uses the same division of days into 24 hours, but starts a day at sunset, meaning that the start of a day changes within the same city throughout the year. France even tried decimal time for a while, where each day has ten hours, each hour has 100 minutes, and each minute has 100 seconds. All of these systems arose from different starting conditions, none of which were āgiving Romans GPSā (they already knew the Earth was round) and none of which caused any problems with users going to sleep at different times of day.
The thought experiment here isnāt āhow could this have happened given existing conditions?ā or even āwhat conditions could have brought this about?ā but rather āassuming a world where some set of conditions brought about a true worldwide UTC without offsets, what would it look like to the users of that system?ā
And this is what youāve decided merits abusive behavior. Canāt imagine what youāre like about stuff that actually matters.
assuming an awful lot about me based on complete ignorance and
Oh another one of āme saying things doesnāt mean anything, you canāt deduce I meant something just because I said it!ā
Iām not.
Youare.
have a significant bias toward the system we already know.
No, youāre pretending to be a pseudointellectuel while missing the actual issues shoved down your face, because you lack understanding and your ego is 3 sizes too big for your skills
Yeah, they were chosen more or less arbitrarily by the ancient Egyptians because there were twelve significant constellations they followed, which led to a sort of base-12 number system they used for stuff related to the sky (months and hours in particular).
Exactly like I said. A pretentious pseudointellectuel and Iām not gonna teach you history. Do some desperate googling and then become ashamed
Again, units and numbers have no inherent meaning
Again, they literally have INHERENT meaning.
Send me your address Iāll order you a dictionary
And I think thereās ample evidence here that youāre just not reading carefully
āBut but youāre laughing at my rhetoric so you canāt have read itā
Zzzz
24-hour day and time zones were somehow inevitable
By what fucking logic? You talk to me of reading comprehension :D
You donāt understand the fundamental flaw in the system, but like I said, Iām not gonna be lecturing you, Iād rather watch you make a moron of yourself and maybe, maybe point out later what Iām talking about.
Thereās a Hindi clock that divides the day into thirty hours. Roman timekeeping was divided into 12 hours, but that time was measured from sunrise to sunset. Byzantine time uses the same division of days into 24 hours, but starts a day at sunset, meaning that the start of a day changes within the same city throughout the year. France even tried decimal time for a while, where each day has ten hours, each hour has 100 minutes, and each minute has 100 seconds. All of these systems arose from different starting conditions, none of which were āgiving Romans GPSā (they already knew the Earth was round) and none of which caused any problems with users going to sleep at different times of day.
You talk to me of word salad while youāre some pseudointellectual 14-year old twerp repeating these sad sixth grade history facts as some unbelievably arcane knowledge while not understanding the fundamental flaw in the whole system.
Oh another one of āme saying things doesnāt mean anything, you canāt deduce I meant something just because I said it!ā
No, itās āyou canāt just unilaterally decide that I actually mean the opposite of what Iām saying.ā
Iām not.
Youare.
Oh, for real? Well, if youāve already decided what I mean, then by all means, donāt let me distract you with reality.
youāre pretending to be a pseudointellectuel
No, Iām definitely a pseudointellectual.
while missing the actual issues shoved down your face, because you lack understanding and your ego is 3 sizes too big for your skills
I have yet to see you actually respond to the points Iāve actually made, only points you think Iāve made, so Iām not sure how you have enough data to determine that I ālack understanding.ā
Exactly like I said. A pretentious pseudointellectuel and Iām not gonna teach you history. Do some desperate googling and then become ashamed
I donāt know what to tell you, bro. We have twelve hours because the ancient Egyptians liked the stars. Thatās just reality. Iād love to hear why you think it is, though.
Again, units and numbers have no inherent meaning
Again, they literally have INHERENT meaning.
Send me your address Iāll order you a dictionary
Before you send it, I recommend you look up the word ācontext.ā
You donāt understand the fundamental flaw in the system, but like I said, Iām not gonna be lecturing you, Iād rather watch you make a moron of yourself and maybe, maybe point out later what Iām talking about.
So, again, no actual argument, youāre just hoping to keep this going for long enough to come up with one.
You talk to me of word salad while youāre some pseudointellectual 14-year old twerp repeating these sad sixth grade history facts as some unbelievably arcane knowledge while not understanding the fundamental flaw in the whole system.
I didnāt think thereās anything arcane about something that can be easily found in a history book. But thanks for assuming Iām 14, thatās very kind of you. I havenāt been assumed to be that young in a long, long time.
You know, just because your short term memory is only ten seconds long, thereās no need to rewrite the whole conversation everytime.
Or did you never develop object permanence and you literally canāt answer a thing if itās not under your eyes, because youāll forget it exists?
No, itās āyou canāt just unilaterally decide that I actually mean the opposite of what Iām saying.ā
When youāre saying hot is cold and up is down, I havenāt decided that your words mean the opposite. Youāre just wrong.
Noon, midday or the number of hours is anything but arbitrary. You being ignorant of the reason doesnāt make you right, it makes you ignorant. Notice anything about the divisibility of the numbers? Noā¦? Oh right, youāre probably American, so thatās probably offensive to ask you about your maths skills. Apologies, I do understand your country is going through a tough time.
I donāt decide the meaning of your words. The world sort of does.
I donāt know what to tell you, bro. We have twelve hours because the ancient Egyptians liked the stars. Thatās just reality. Iād love to hear why you think it is, though.
Like I said, Iām not your history teacher, and you are just completely ignorant of the subject. You have to know how dumb you are though, but your ego just keeps ripping right through.
See I could teach you. Then youād pretend you knew it all the time. Youāre just a pseudointellectual lazy piece of shit who doesnāt know the first thing about the subject and didnāt even click ātimekeeping in other culturesā when he did his pathetic Wikipedia browsing. Which is exactly why you insist on your silly kittle ignorance.
Youāre plain wrong. I will tell you eventually how badly, but now Iām just gonna sip on your dumb juice. So sweet.
Oh I havenāt argued you at any point, and would never. Iād have an easier time teaching a dog to whistle, lol.
You know, just because your short term memory is only ten seconds long, thereās no need to rewrite the whole conversation everytime.
Because of your stubborn refusal to actually read anything Iāve written, I copy it back down in hopes that youāll see your own words and actually continue reading beyond the end of the quote. Though, admittedly, itās not going well at the moment.
Noon, midday or the number of hours is anything but arbitrary.
Noon is not, correct. Midday is not, correct. But while the fact that weāve assigned any particular celestial event a number is more logical than a horoscope, itās no less arbitrary. Are you truly suggesting that our lives would be significantly different if we all grew up in a world where a new day began at noon, and so we called noon 0000? Or if we began a new day when most people woke up, and so we indexed noon at 0600 so that people could wake up at 0000?
Yes, you going into that world from this one would be startled (or, judging by your tone here, deeply offended), but any version of you that grew up in that world would think it very normal and logical.
You being ignorant of the reason doesnāt make you right, it makes you ignorant.
Interesting. Because Iāve given actual facts here proving me correct about the reason for these things, but you continue to assert that Iām wrong and thereās definitely a reason (even though you wonāt say what it is).
Notice anything about the divisibility of the numbers? Noā¦?
You mean the fact that 12 is divisible by 2, 3, 4, and 6? That is a nifty coincidence, isnāt it? Definitely super useful. Good thing the Egyptians liked twelve constellations, huh? But it wasnāt in any way intentional. Might be why it caught on, though.
Apologies, I do understand your country is going through a tough time.
Thank you, I appreciate it. It, uhā¦itās not great over here.
Like I said, Iām not your history teacher, and you are just completely ignorant of the subject. You have to know how dumb you are though, but your ego just keeps ripping right through.
Egyptians liked the stars and thought those 12 constellations were important, so they divided up the night into that many hours. Just like I said.
See I could teach you. Then youād pretend you knew it all the time.
I probably wouldnāt need to pretend, since youāre pathologically resistant to actually reading what I write. In fact, youāre probably going to reply to me about how āno, you idiot, itās because the Egyptians thought that a particular set of 12 constellations were important!ā next, arenāt you?
See, you keep on asserting your intelligence and telling me Iām wrong, but then just leaving the assertion there by itself and telling me to do my own research. Itās not my job to prove your point for you, though. Thatās up to you.
Youāre just a pseudointellectual
I believe I already answered that assertion in the affirmative, yes.
and didnāt even click ātimekeeping in other culturesā when he did his pathetic Wikipedia browsing.
Actually I did click that one just now! and it proves that whole thing I said in some other comment about how other cultures have different timekeeping systems which means that itās not inherent and is actually totally arbitrary! But since you didnāt read that, I guess I shouldnāt be surprised that you didnāt know.
Which is exactly why you insist on your silly kittle ignorance.
Hereās a dramatic paraphrase of our interaction so far.
Me: āI mean, A isnāt any more or less logical than B.ā
You: āYOUR AN IDIOT A IS OBVIOUSLY MORE LOGICAL THAN B OMG YOU SHOULD BE SHOTā
Me: āWhat? Thatās a strange amount of rage for something so mild, but what reason do you have for your opinion?ā
You: āLOL NO IM NOT MAD UR JUST TRIGGERED IDIOT. A IS OBVIOUSLY MORE LOGICAL THAN B AND I DONT NEED TO TELL YOU MY REASON BECAUSE YOUR SO DUMB YOU SHOULD BE ABLE TO FIGURE IT OUT YOURSELF STUPIDHEAD. OMG YOUR SO MAD AND TRIGGERED LOLOLOLOLā
Me: āThatā¦isnāt actually a reason? See, here are a couple of reasons.ā
You: āSEE YOU DONT HAVE ANY REASONS AT ALL LOLOL TRIGGERED, A IS OBVIOUSLY MORE LOGICAL THAN Bā
Me: āWhat? I just gave you reasons, did you not even see them? Here, have some more. And why do you keep yelling the same thing over and over again?ā
You: āKEK YOU ARE IGNORANT, A IS OBVIOUSLY MORE LOGICAL THAN B, U DONT KNOW ANYTHING, DONT HAVE ANY REASONS LOLOLOLā
Me: āā¦blink twice if youāre in danger, bro.ā
Youāre plain wrong. I will tell you eventually how badly, but now Iām just gonna sip on your dumb juice. So sweet.
Ok, this is going to sound like an insult, but itās actually an honest question: are you literally a pre-teen? Because all this time I had been assuming youāre an adult, but if Iām dealing with a child I should probably recalibrate my expectations. It would certainly explain your ludicrous position, your bizarre rage disguised under the laughter, and the phrase ādumb juice.ā
You keep writing essays because youāre too fucking ashamed to admit you didnāt understand what the word arbitrary means.
Remember how Iāve said, several times, that even your argument about 12, 24, 30 or 100 hour systems being āarbitraryā is wrong? Why not include that in your essay? Is it because youāre ashamed of having been wrong, because you like to pretend to understand shit and pretend to be smart. Because online, thereās no-one to mock you for it. Or, so you thought. ;>
You get angry because I refuse to give you the answers and the only place someone with your intelligence will look is fkin Wikipedia. The timekeeping in my culture isnāt even mentioned there.
How many language did you speak again? ;>
Iāll get back to you on your other pathetic essay tomorrow, just woke up to pee.
any particular celestial event a number is more logical than a horoscope, itās no less arbitrary
Again, just because you donāt know the reason for a thing doesnāt mean it doesnāt exist, sweetums.
Oh no, you think youāve āgiven factsā, just like a child playing at kitchen with mudcakes has āactually cookedā.
No [I donāt notice anything about the divisibility of hours]ā¦?
Again, just because YOU personally fail to see logic in something doesnāt mean it doesnāt have any. And itās just driving you mental having me not tell you the answers so you can pretend to have known all the time.
The fact youāre writing every one of my ārepliesā as if Iām yelling itās just candy to my eyes, because it tells me youāre fucking seething at me mocking you. Cheers bruv. <3
Bro, just admit that youāre surprised I actually do know something about the history of timekeeping and we can move on. Or tell me where you think Iām wrong and we can move on. One way or another, this āhuehue I know somethin u dont knowā routine is getting really tired, so Iām going to start ignoring the unsourced nonsense.
You keep writing essays
Actually, theyāre a pretty standard length for me. Iām fairly verbose, and always have been.
you didnāt understand what the word arbitrary means.
Unsupported assertions are definitely a great way to convince me, thatās for sure. Weāve definitely proven that.
Remember how Iāve said, several times, that even your argument about 12, 24, 30 or 100 hour systems being āarbitraryā is wrong? Why not include that in your essay?
Said, yes. With no support or evidence for your claims, so I treat them as nonsense.
Is it because youāre ashamed of having been wrong,
I absolutely love being proven wrong, actually! I like learning new things, and it totally floors people when I admit that they were right and apologize. But you have yet to actually prove literally anything, so Iām not particularly hopeful about that this time.
Because online, thereās no-one to mock you for it. Or, so you thought. ;>
Itās just random insults if you donāt have any facts to back it up. You look like an abusive fool, rather than like youāve won an argument. Iāve been in online arguments, in one forum or another, since likeā¦1995? Earlier? Not sure. There are definitely always idiots around to mock me for what they think is being wrong.
You get angry
Not angry in the least. Iām having a great time.
because I refuse to give you the answers
Usually people with any evidence at all are super excited to provide it in defense of their point. The fact that you arenāt even telling me what your evidence says indicates that you donāt have any.
and the only place someone with your intelligence will look is fkin Wikipedia.
I read a book a while ago about the history of timekeeping. I honestly hadnāt even seen the Wikipedia article until today.
The timekeeping in my culture isnāt even mentioned there.
But wait! I thought everyone had an inherent understanding of the current worldwide timekeeping method! How could there possibly be any other culturesā timekeeping methods?
How many language did you speak again? ;>
Non sequitur.
Iāll get back to you on your other pathetic essay tomorrow, just woke up to pee.
Iām honored.
Again, just because you donāt know the reason for a thing doesnāt mean it doesnāt exist, sweetums.
Pretty sure I told you that, just a few comments ago.
No [I donāt notice anything about the divisibility of hours]ā¦?
You have completely mischaracterized my entire comment.
itās just driving you mental having me not tell you the answers so you can pretend to have known all the time.
No, Iām just more and more confident all the time that you donāt actually have a point and are just hoping that Iāll supply one for you in the process of trying to rebut your nonsense.
The fact youāre writing every one of my ārepliesā as if Iām yelling itās just candy to my eyes,
Youāre the one that came in swinging with insults and name-calling. The fallacies are the logical equivalent of shouting and banging the table. I quote your replies because Iāve seen enough bad faith arguments from you that I wouldnāt put it past you to just edit your comment or intentionally pretend like Iām responding to something I am not.
seething
You really are a pre-teen, arenāt you?
Anyway, this one was way more boring than your usual. You keep on diving deeper and deeper into bad faith arguments, and thatās just disappointing. You can do better than that.
You literally donāt know anything about the history of timekeeping. Thatās the point. You keep pretending to, because youāve read a Wikipedia article. And you donāt see why youāre being ridiculed?
The systems which humanity have used have not been arbitrary and every single āargumentā youāve made showcases your stupidity and ignorance.
How many languages was it you spoke again?
Give me your address and Iāll order a āgrammar for kidsā book and a dictionary for you. In English, as I presume itās the only language you sort of understand.
Itās not about the length of your replies, itās about who theyāre formatted like a teenager with Alzheimerās.
What do you mean āno support for your claims about timekeeping systems not being arbitraryā? You canāt be serious. You just canāt. You still donāt understand what the word arbitrary even means?
:DDdddddd
This is the best wake up comment I couldāve read. Put a laugh in my day right away hahaha thank you. Also I donāt believe a person like you has read a single book in your entire life.
You literally donāt know anything about the history of timekeeping. Thatās the point.
Assertion isnāt evidence. You have yet to actually say a single thing about why you think Iām wrong, just that you do. This is not how argumentation and debate work.
And you donāt see why youāre being ridiculed?
This isnāt ridicule, itās just baseless name-calling. This is elementary school-level insults. If it were ridicule, it would have any evidence behind it at all. The longer you go without providing any basis for your claims, the more clear it becomes that you have none.
The systems which humanity have used have not been arbitrary
Every system humanity uses is arbitrary. We decide and agree that something arbitrary is useful, and then we decide to imbue that arbitrary thing with meaning.
Words didnāt mean anything until we assigned meaning to them, and you can tell theyāre arbitrary because the same combination of syllables can mean something completely different in another language. For someone who claims to know multiple languages, you should be aware of that. Meters arenāt meters because they have to be; we decided that the distance light travels in 0.000000003335641s is a useful amount of distance. We couldāve easily defined it as the distance light travels in 0.000000003335642s and it wouldnāt be any more or less logical.
Thatās how humans work. We give arbitrary things meaning. You insisting that the shapes in the clouds are definitely sharks doesnāt make them sharks. The shapes are arbitrary.
and every single āargumentā youāve made showcases your stupidity and ignorance.
Contrasted with the complete lack of argument youāve made.
Give me your address and Iāll order a āgrammar for kidsā book and a dictionary for you.
Aw, buddy, you already tried that insult once. And it wasnāt funny the first time.
Itās not about the length of your replies, itās about who theyāre formatted like a teenager with Alzheimerās.
Now that oneās funny! Good job. I knew you could do it.
What do you mean āno support for your claims about timekeeping systems not being arbitraryā?
I mean, support your claims that thereās something inherent about timekeeping systems. Something in our brains, or in the rotation of the Earth, or in the physical properties of light, or something that means that high noon has to be represented on the clock as 1200.
Thatās what āsupportā means. Thatās what evidence is. Thatās what any reasonable, good-faith argument has to include.
You still donāt understand what the word arbitrary even means?
I am starting to think that you believe āarbitraryā means ārandom.ā But that isnāt what it means. It means ārandomly chosen,ā or perhaps āselected without impetus.ā The Egyptians didnāt have to choose twelve constellations; nobody was forcing them to, and there wasnāt anything inherent about them that required them to base a system of timekeeping around it.
This is the best wake up comment I couldāve read. Put a laugh in my day right away hahaha thank you.
Youāre welcome! I love knowing that Iām helping put some joy into the world.
Also I donāt believe a person like you has read a single book in your entire life.
Oh, thanks for the reminder, I forgot to log the book I finished yesterday.
Youāre assuming an awful lot about me based on complete ignorance and using those assumptions to justify a really bizarre level of abuse.
Iām not. Thatās literally the premise of the idea proposed here. The fact that you donāt get that is really making me question your reading comprehension abilities.
Correct. Iām not. As Iāve noted several times now, Iām not proposing anything. Iām just pointing out that we have a significant bias toward the system we already know.
Yeah, they were chosen more or less arbitrarily by the ancient Egyptians because there were twelve significant constellations they followed, which led to a sort of base-12 number system they used for stuff related to the sky (months and hours in particular).
Again, units and numbers have no inherent meaning. We made it all up. A day could just as easily have had ten hours of 144 minutes each, or 40 hours of 36 minutes each.
The fact that you donāt understand what Iām saying doesnāt mean that Iām not making sense. And I think thereās ample evidence here that youāre just not reading carefully.
Ok. Deciphering your word salad here, I think youāre trying to suggest that our current 24-hour day and time zones were somehow inevitable? Whichā¦I mean, obviously they arenāt, since there are many cultures that independently came up with different time systems.
Thereās a Hindi clock that divides the day into thirty hours. Roman timekeeping was divided into 12 hours, but that time was measured from sunrise to sunset. Byzantine time uses the same division of days into 24 hours, but starts a day at sunset, meaning that the start of a day changes within the same city throughout the year. France even tried decimal time for a while, where each day has ten hours, each hour has 100 minutes, and each minute has 100 seconds. All of these systems arose from different starting conditions, none of which were āgiving Romans GPSā (they already knew the Earth was round) and none of which caused any problems with users going to sleep at different times of day.
The thought experiment here isnāt āhow could this have happened given existing conditions?ā or even āwhat conditions could have brought this about?ā but rather āassuming a world where some set of conditions brought about a true worldwide UTC without offsets, what would it look like to the users of that system?ā
And this is what youāve decided merits abusive behavior. Canāt imagine what youāre like about stuff that actually matters.
Oh another one of āme saying things doesnāt mean anything, you canāt deduce I meant something just because I said it!ā
You are.
No, youāre pretending to be a pseudointellectuel while missing the actual issues shoved down your face, because you lack understanding and your ego is 3 sizes too big for your skills
Exactly like I said. A pretentious pseudointellectuel and Iām not gonna teach you history. Do some desperate googling and then become ashamed
Again, they literally have INHERENT meaning.
Send me your address Iāll order you a dictionary
āBut but youāre laughing at my rhetoric so you canāt have read itā
Zzzz
By what fucking logic? You talk to me of reading comprehension :D
You donāt understand the fundamental flaw in the system, but like I said, Iām not gonna be lecturing you, Iād rather watch you make a moron of yourself and maybe, maybe point out later what Iām talking about.
You talk to me of word salad while youāre some pseudointellectual 14-year old twerp repeating these sad sixth grade history facts as some unbelievably arcane knowledge while not understanding the fundamental flaw in the whole system.
No, itās āyou canāt just unilaterally decide that I actually mean the opposite of what Iām saying.ā
Oh, for real? Well, if youāve already decided what I mean, then by all means, donāt let me distract you with reality.
No, Iām definitely a pseudointellectual.
I have yet to see you actually respond to the points Iāve actually made, only points you think Iāve made, so Iām not sure how you have enough data to determine that I ālack understanding.ā
I donāt know what to tell you, bro. We have twelve hours because the ancient Egyptians liked the stars. Thatās just reality. Iād love to hear why you think it is, though.
Before you send it, I recommend you look up the word ācontext.ā
So, again, no actual argument, youāre just hoping to keep this going for long enough to come up with one.
I didnāt think thereās anything arcane about something that can be easily found in a history book. But thanks for assuming Iām 14, thatās very kind of you. I havenāt been assumed to be that young in a long, long time.
You know, just because your short term memory is only ten seconds long, thereās no need to rewrite the whole conversation everytime.
Or did you never develop object permanence and you literally canāt answer a thing if itās not under your eyes, because youāll forget it exists?
When youāre saying hot is cold and up is down, I havenāt decided that your words mean the opposite. Youāre just wrong.
Noon, midday or the number of hours is anything but arbitrary. You being ignorant of the reason doesnāt make you right, it makes you ignorant. Notice anything about the divisibility of the numbers? Noā¦? Oh right, youāre probably American, so thatās probably offensive to ask you about your maths skills. Apologies, I do understand your country is going through a tough time.
I donāt decide the meaning of your words. The world sort of does.
Like I said, Iām not your history teacher, and you are just completely ignorant of the subject. You have to know how dumb you are though, but your ego just keeps ripping right through.
See I could teach you. Then youād pretend you knew it all the time. Youāre just a pseudointellectual lazy piece of shit who doesnāt know the first thing about the subject and didnāt even click ātimekeeping in other culturesā when he did his pathetic Wikipedia browsing. Which is exactly why you insist on your silly kittle ignorance.
Youāre plain wrong. I will tell you eventually how badly, but now Iām just gonna sip on your dumb juice. So sweet.
Oh I havenāt argued you at any point, and would never. Iād have an easier time teaching a dog to whistle, lol.
Because of your stubborn refusal to actually read anything Iāve written, I copy it back down in hopes that youāll see your own words and actually continue reading beyond the end of the quote. Though, admittedly, itās not going well at the moment.
Noon is not, correct. Midday is not, correct. But while the fact that weāve assigned any particular celestial event a number is more logical than a horoscope, itās no less arbitrary. Are you truly suggesting that our lives would be significantly different if we all grew up in a world where a new day began at noon, and so we called noon 0000? Or if we began a new day when most people woke up, and so we indexed noon at 0600 so that people could wake up at 0000?
Yes, you going into that world from this one would be startled (or, judging by your tone here, deeply offended), but any version of you that grew up in that world would think it very normal and logical.
Interesting. Because Iāve given actual facts here proving me correct about the reason for these things, but you continue to assert that Iām wrong and thereās definitely a reason (even though you wonāt say what it is).
You mean the fact that 12 is divisible by 2, 3, 4, and 6? That is a nifty coincidence, isnāt it? Definitely super useful. Good thing the Egyptians liked twelve constellations, huh? But it wasnāt in any way intentional. Might be why it caught on, though.
Thank you, I appreciate it. It, uhā¦itās not great over here.
I just went to look it up and see if Iād somehow misremembered from the books I read a while back when I was hyperfocused on the subject. But lookie there! āIn ancient Egypt the flooding of the Nile was, and still is, an important annual event, crucial for agriculture. It was accompanied by the rise of Sirius before the sunrise, and the appearance of 12 constellations across the night sky, to which the Egyptians assigned some significance. Influenced by this, the Egyptians divided the night into 12 equal intervals. These were seasonal hours, shorter in the summer than in the winter. Subsequently, the day was divided into intervals as well, which eventually became more important than the nightly intervals. These subdivisions of a day spread to Greece, and later to Rome.ā (emphasis mine)
Egyptians liked the stars and thought those 12 constellations were important, so they divided up the night into that many hours. Just like I said.
I probably wouldnāt need to pretend, since youāre pathologically resistant to actually reading what I write. In fact, youāre probably going to reply to me about how āno, you idiot, itās because the Egyptians thought that a particular set of 12 constellations were important!ā next, arenāt you?
See, you keep on asserting your intelligence and telling me Iām wrong, but then just leaving the assertion there by itself and telling me to do my own research. Itās not my job to prove your point for you, though. Thatās up to you.
I believe I already answered that assertion in the affirmative, yes.
Actually I did click that one just now! and it proves that whole thing I said in some other comment about how other cultures have different timekeeping systems which means that itās not inherent and is actually totally arbitrary! But since you didnāt read that, I guess I shouldnāt be surprised that you didnāt know.
Hereās a dramatic paraphrase of our interaction so far.
Me: āI mean, A isnāt any more or less logical than B.ā
You: āYOUR AN IDIOT A IS OBVIOUSLY MORE LOGICAL THAN B OMG YOU SHOULD BE SHOTā
Me: āWhat? Thatās a strange amount of rage for something so mild, but what reason do you have for your opinion?ā
You: āLOL NO IM NOT MAD UR JUST TRIGGERED IDIOT. A IS OBVIOUSLY MORE LOGICAL THAN B AND I DONT NEED TO TELL YOU MY REASON BECAUSE YOUR SO DUMB YOU SHOULD BE ABLE TO FIGURE IT OUT YOURSELF STUPIDHEAD. OMG YOUR SO MAD AND TRIGGERED LOLOLOLOLā
Me: āThatā¦isnāt actually a reason? See, here are a couple of reasons.ā
You: āSEE YOU DONT HAVE ANY REASONS AT ALL LOLOL TRIGGERED, A IS OBVIOUSLY MORE LOGICAL THAN Bā
Me: āWhat? I just gave you reasons, did you not even see them? Here, have some more. And why do you keep yelling the same thing over and over again?ā
You: āKEK YOU ARE IGNORANT, A IS OBVIOUSLY MORE LOGICAL THAN B, U DONT KNOW ANYTHING, DONT HAVE ANY REASONS LOLOLOLā
Me: āā¦blink twice if youāre in danger, bro.ā
Ok, this is going to sound like an insult, but itās actually an honest question: are you literally a pre-teen? Because all this time I had been assuming youāre an adult, but if Iām dealing with a child I should probably recalibrate my expectations. It would certainly explain your ludicrous position, your bizarre rage disguised under the laughter, and the phrase ādumb juice.ā
Wikipedia doesnāt cover even the basics.
You keep writing essays because youāre too fucking ashamed to admit you didnāt understand what the word arbitrary means.
Remember how Iāve said, several times, that even your argument about 12, 24, 30 or 100 hour systems being āarbitraryā is wrong? Why not include that in your essay? Is it because youāre ashamed of having been wrong, because you like to pretend to understand shit and pretend to be smart. Because online, thereās no-one to mock you for it. Or, so you thought. ;>
You get angry because I refuse to give you the answers and the only place someone with your intelligence will look is fkin Wikipedia. The timekeeping in my culture isnāt even mentioned there.
How many language did you speak again? ;>
Iāll get back to you on your other pathetic essay tomorrow, just woke up to pee.
Again, just because you donāt know the reason for a thing doesnāt mean it doesnāt exist, sweetums.
Oh no, you think youāve āgiven factsā, just like a child playing at kitchen with mudcakes has āactually cookedā.
Again, just because YOU personally fail to see logic in something doesnāt mean it doesnāt have any. And itās just driving you mental having me not tell you the answers so you can pretend to have known all the time.
The fact youāre writing every one of my ārepliesā as if Iām yelling itās just candy to my eyes, because it tells me youāre fucking seething at me mocking you. Cheers bruv. <3
āWhy donāt you even look at Wikipedia?ā
āUGH NO NOT LIKE THATā
Bro, just admit that youāre surprised I actually do know something about the history of timekeeping and we can move on. Or tell me where you think Iām wrong and we can move on. One way or another, this āhuehue I know somethin u dont knowā routine is getting really tired, so Iām going to start ignoring the unsourced nonsense.
Actually, theyāre a pretty standard length for me. Iām fairly verbose, and always have been.
Unsupported assertions are definitely a great way to convince me, thatās for sure. Weāve definitely proven that.
Said, yes. With no support or evidence for your claims, so I treat them as nonsense.
I absolutely love being proven wrong, actually! I like learning new things, and it totally floors people when I admit that they were right and apologize. But you have yet to actually prove literally anything, so Iām not particularly hopeful about that this time.
Itās just random insults if you donāt have any facts to back it up. You look like an abusive fool, rather than like youāve won an argument. Iāve been in online arguments, in one forum or another, since likeā¦1995? Earlier? Not sure. There are definitely always idiots around to mock me for what they think is being wrong.
Not angry in the least. Iām having a great time.
Usually people with any evidence at all are super excited to provide it in defense of their point. The fact that you arenāt even telling me what your evidence says indicates that you donāt have any.
I read a book a while ago about the history of timekeeping. I honestly hadnāt even seen the Wikipedia article until today.
But wait! I thought everyone had an inherent understanding of the current worldwide timekeeping method! How could there possibly be any other culturesā timekeeping methods?
Non sequitur.
Iām honored.
Pretty sure I told you that, just a few comments ago.
You have completely mischaracterized my entire comment.
No, Iām just more and more confident all the time that you donāt actually have a point and are just hoping that Iāll supply one for you in the process of trying to rebut your nonsense.
Youāre the one that came in swinging with insults and name-calling. The fallacies are the logical equivalent of shouting and banging the table. I quote your replies because Iāve seen enough bad faith arguments from you that I wouldnāt put it past you to just edit your comment or intentionally pretend like Iām responding to something I am not.
You really are a pre-teen, arenāt you?
Anyway, this one was way more boring than your usual. You keep on diving deeper and deeper into bad faith arguments, and thatās just disappointing. You can do better than that.
You literally donāt know anything about the history of timekeeping. Thatās the point. You keep pretending to, because youāve read a Wikipedia article. And you donāt see why youāre being ridiculed?
The systems which humanity have used have not been arbitrary and every single āargumentā youāve made showcases your stupidity and ignorance.
How many languages was it you spoke again?
Give me your address and Iāll order a āgrammar for kidsā book and a dictionary for you. In English, as I presume itās the only language you sort of understand.
Itās not about the length of your replies, itās about who theyāre formatted like a teenager with Alzheimerās.
What do you mean āno support for your claims about timekeeping systems not being arbitraryā? You canāt be serious. You just canāt. You still donāt understand what the word arbitrary even means?
:DDdddddd
This is the best wake up comment I couldāve read. Put a laugh in my day right away hahaha thank you. Also I donāt believe a person like you has read a single book in your entire life.
Assertion isnāt evidence. You have yet to actually say a single thing about why you think Iām wrong, just that you do. This is not how argumentation and debate work.
This isnāt ridicule, itās just baseless name-calling. This is elementary school-level insults. If it were ridicule, it would have any evidence behind it at all. The longer you go without providing any basis for your claims, the more clear it becomes that you have none.
Every system humanity uses is arbitrary. We decide and agree that something arbitrary is useful, and then we decide to imbue that arbitrary thing with meaning.
Words didnāt mean anything until we assigned meaning to them, and you can tell theyāre arbitrary because the same combination of syllables can mean something completely different in another language. For someone who claims to know multiple languages, you should be aware of that. Meters arenāt meters because they have to be; we decided that the distance light travels in 0.000000003335641s is a useful amount of distance. We couldāve easily defined it as the distance light travels in 0.000000003335642s and it wouldnāt be any more or less logical.
Thatās how humans work. We give arbitrary things meaning. You insisting that the shapes in the clouds are definitely sharks doesnāt make them sharks. The shapes are arbitrary.
Contrasted with the complete lack of argument youāve made.
Aw, buddy, you already tried that insult once. And it wasnāt funny the first time.
Now that oneās funny! Good job. I knew you could do it.
I mean, support your claims that thereās something inherent about timekeeping systems. Something in our brains, or in the rotation of the Earth, or in the physical properties of light, or something that means that high noon has to be represented on the clock as 1200.
Thatās what āsupportā means. Thatās what evidence is. Thatās what any reasonable, good-faith argument has to include.
I am starting to think that you believe āarbitraryā means ārandom.ā But that isnāt what it means. It means ārandomly chosen,ā or perhaps āselected without impetus.ā The Egyptians didnāt have to choose twelve constellations; nobody was forcing them to, and there wasnāt anything inherent about them that required them to base a system of timekeeping around it.
Youāre welcome! I love knowing that Iām helping put some joy into the world.
Oh, thanks for the reminder, I forgot to log the book I finished yesterday.